General Centres for 2025

[Mr. Brownstone]

Well everyone knows your opinion. only issue is you don’t back it up with facts & evidence.

Yes I did - posted about his try & line break assists on this thread.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

CNK and Ali missed one tackle between them. And while it *should* be about defence, its not. As Marata and Walker have been horrific, and yet still walk out in the 17.

You’re pretty much counter-arguing your own argument. Who cares if Ali and CNK missed 1 tackle. It’s hardly a large sample size.

I fear there’s a “second coming of Jesus” with some members on this forum in regards to Ali Leiataua. I genuinely hope he works out, I believe he will. But just letting him walk in? Madness…..
None the less, he is the future.

I will be closely watching this forum in regards to Ali and naming and shaming when/if the knives come out.

On the topic of Marata Niukore, I’ve made plenty of posts of what I think of him and his salary.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

You’re pretty much counter-arguing your own argument. Who cares if Ali and CNK missed 1 tackle. It’s hardly a large sample size.

Huh? its a counter point to YOUR argument; it wasnt a poor defensive showing. MY argument is we dont have to wait to see if Ali is an attacking threat, he already is one.

 

[BlackToko88]

I voted for Ali x CNK mainly cause I want to see TT at FB. But with Webbys media chat last week looks unlikely of CNK to center. I wouldnt mind seeing how he progresses during preseason, and whether his dip in form was due to injuries throughout the season.

For me id shift RTS to the wing (have him train preseason there and cover FB during game for injury).

Starting centers, can see Webby going with Berry and Pompey with Ali listed in the 23 man list. If TT isnt playing, then we would only have one goal kicker which would be Metcalf so having someone like Pompey there gives you backup. Plus Pompey at center is no slouch, he can run good lines, and isnt a slouch defensively.

Ali defs has the highest ceiling, can see him potentially overtaking either of the two.

 

[Christchurch_Warrior]

Some of the stats thrown about while interesting does not always convey what you see on the field. As of now Ali has a tackle efficiency of 88.6%. Crichton has a tackle efficiency of 83.3%. Ali is by that stat up with some of the best Centre's in the comp. Anyone with eyes though can see he is not quite there yet defensively. He needs FG games to improve though.
I think if Webster goes with the game plan of 2023/2024 then it will be a Berry/Pompey as he will want defenders. With him not really having a controlling half I hope he changes the game plan and uses the attacking ability of Ali and Leka.

Link for where I got Ali's tackle efficiency.

Ali Leiataua

The NRL profile of Ali Leiataua including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.

www.warriors.kiwi

 

[MrFrankWhite]

For me

Ali > Pompey
CNK > Berry

 

[John Nick]

Some of the stats thrown about while interesting does not always convey what you see on the field. As of now Ali has a tackle efficiency of 88.6%. Crichton has a tackle efficiency of 83.3%. Ali is by that stat up with some of the best Centre's in the comp. Anyone with eyes though can see he is not quite there yet defensively. He needs FG games to improve though.
I think if Webster goes with the game plan of 2023/2024 then it will be a Berry/Pompey as he will want defenders. With him not really having a controlling half I hope he changes the game plan and uses the attacking ability of Ali and Leka.

Link for where I got Ali's tackle efficiency.

Ali Leiataua

The NRL profile of Ali Leiataua including career statistics, season stats, games, tries, goals, tackles and fantasy scores.

www.warriors.kiwi

Agreed. Stats don't take in the opposition state of the game, conditions etc.
Can be very misleading

 

[CWC]

If our defense system is still shocking like this year then it's definitely Ali+CNK for me, I mean we don't win that Sharks game without spreading the ball wide with Metcalf and Ali threatening all night and literally busting through the line.

If we are built on defense then you could argue Pompey/Berry and we're choking the opposition

Ali's 22 next year so no reason to keep him in Cup, same with Taine (26 next year), we're not the Black Caps holding players back till they're 30.

IMO CNK can be utility and Ali will need rest or will be injured often, so Berry and Pompey will get plenty of game time anyway, TBH everyone will get a bit of game time, unless Webby sticks CNK at FB and Taine will get like 3 games a season again

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

Huh? its a counter point to YOUR argument; it wasnt a poor defensive showing. MY argument is we dont have to wait to see if Ali is an attacking threat, he already is one.

You said “it *should* be about defence, it’s not”. You’re counter arguing your own argument.
I’ll explain; If it *should* all be about defence. Then Pompey and Rocco are the clear round 1 combo…...
NOT *aw we suck at defence anyway, so let’s just attack* What? How many teams have won the NRL like that? None……….. like actually, none………

It was one game……. One…….. And Ali and CNK played really well, dare I say crucial to that win. And now all of a sudden they’re the answer?
Hell there’s a strong argument that we benefit from questionable reffing decisions. That’s the argument on ALL the Australian shows/podcasts. (I don’t care about that, it’s about time we got one of those games)

Must I remind everyone that Rocco and Pompey got us to the finals last year?
You know, actual SUSTAINED success……
Not……. One game.

 

[Wrighty]

What’s webby done to him lol.

That a lot of us here are thinking we’re better off without him.
Still has a lot to offer I think, probably not at centre tho

It's madness led by two or three heavyweight forum posters. He is still an oustanding player. There would be very few teams who would not take him if offered him.
He just needs the right position. Despite those stats I can't recall him creating anything offensively at centre.
Wing is an important position which gets many touches in league. Put him on wing with Montoya first reserve. RTS and Dallin get injured so much Montoya will get at least 14-15 games.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

You said “it *should* be about defence, it’s not”.

My brother in christ, repeat the last 2 words.

It was one game……. One…….. And Ali and CNK played really well, dare I say crucial to that win. And now all of a sudden they’re the answer?
Must I remind everyone that Rocco and Pompey got us to the finals last year?
You know, actual SUSTAINED success……
Not……. One game.

CNK got us to the finals too by that argument, but its a rubbish one. They were two players in a team that made the finals, so what? Lol one finals campaign out of the last 3. Sustained success?

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

My brother in christ, repeat the last 2 words.

CNK got us to the finals too by that argument, but its a rubbish one. They were two players in a team that made the finals, so what? Lol one finals campaign out of the last 3. Sustained success?

Brother, I did. The last two words in that statement are completely irrelevant. Defence IS the most important thing.
Ok, you explain then; what does “it’s not” in regards to defence mean? Please explain…

Yeah CNK did…… at fullback. What are you trying to argue with there? How is it that rubbish? That’s exactly what happened…..

Pompey and Rocco played the last 17 games on the trot as our centre combo for 12 wins. In 2023

They combined 5 times this year for 3 wins and 2 losses against Roosters and Storm.
(Please feel free to double check those numbers, it was very quick)

That……. Is a pretty sustained combo quite frankly.
Well, better than pinning our hopes on a 1 game combo. With an extremely talented rookie with questionable defence.

To be clear, Ali Leiataua is the future and easily has the highest ceiling. Just not quite yet.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Brother, I did. The last two words in that statement are completely irrelevant. Defence IS the most important thing.
Ok, you explain then; what does “it’s not” in regards to defence mean? Please explain…

Yeah CNK did…… at fullback. What are you trying to argue with there? How is it that rubbish? That’s exactly what happened…..

Pompey and Rocco played the last 17 games on the trot as our centre combo for 12 wins. In 2023

They combined 5 times this year for 3 wins and 2 losses against Roosters and Storm.
(Please feel free to double check those numbers, it was very quick)

That……. Is a pretty sustained combo quite frankly.
Well, better than pinning our hopes on a 1 game combo. With an extremely talented rookie with questionable defence.

To be clear, Ali Leiataua is the future and easily has the highest ceiling. Just not quite yet.

Bruh this is giving me PTSD of going around in circles with Juju. You’ve done another 180° to be back where we started and asking me questions I answered in the original post.

It’s currently NOT about defence, because Webby still selects dudes who can’t defend.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

And for more clarification, I think CNK is superior to Berry in almost all aspects of play. So I dont think we are losing anything with that swap. We lose Pompey's D and goal kicking but we gain genuine X-factor with Ali which we dont have anywhere.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

Haha yeah, I got all that.
I haven’t done a 180 bro. I want Pompey and Rocco cause they’re our most experienced centres (actual centres) and the best defenders. (With RTS moving to wing). For at least the first 3 rounds.

Your argument, in a nutshell. Let’s not worry about defence. Because we’re shit at defence (cause Webby continues to pick shit defenders. Which I kinda agree with).
So let’s attack? With Ali and CNK (assuming Taine at the back). Yip, that’s bound to be a recipe for success…… One game…..

If not……… If defence is the priority (which it should be) then the right combo for the first 3 rounds is……. Adam Pompey and Rocco Berry. 22 games for like 15 wins in the last 2 seasons.

We’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.
Which is quite strange cause I typically see that we agree with each other a fair bit. Lol

You know Webby is just gonna fit CNK and RTS in somewhere.

 

[Wrighty]

Haha yeah, I got all that.
I haven’t done a 180 bro. I want Pompey and Rocco cause they’re our most experienced centres (actual centres) and the best defenders. (With RTS moving to wing). For at least the first 3 rounds.

Your argument, in a nutshell. Let’s not worry about defence. Because we’re shit at defence (cause Webby continues to pick shit defenders. Which I kinda agree with).
So let’s attack? With Ali and CNK (assuming Taine at the back). Yip, that’s bound to be a recipe for success…… One game…..

If not……… If defence is the priority (which it should be) then the right combo for the first 3 rounds is……. Adam Pompey and Rocco Berry. 22 games for like 15 wins in the last 2 seasons.

We’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.
Which is quite strange cause I typically see that we agree with each other a fair bit. Lol

You know Webby is just gonna fit CNK and RTS in somewhere.

Your debate with Frank White is good natured and fascinating at the same time. It is boiling down to a debate Inruin and I had the other evening on which is more important out of Offence and Defence for winning games. I pulled out of the debate as I want to just observe this years playoffs and how the Warriors evolve further before I debate anyone.
That said my starting position is the same Wizard of Tauranga's point that both are important. You gain confidence from both sides of the ball. Your defence improves when you attack and convert offensively. If you are inept offensively you drop your lip in all aspects. Why? Because they are human beings.
Here are some factoids to throw into this...
1) When a top ranked run and gun offensive juggernaut plays a defensive powerhouse in the super bowl usually the defensive powerhouse carves up. However in watching these games the defensive powerhouse are no mugs offensively and often put on a high score against the offensive juggernaut team.
2) Sure granted Pompey and Rocco got us to the playoffs last year - were you aware that Ennis singled them out in his pre playoffs predictions last year. The Warriors will absolutely not win the premiership in 2023 despite finishing in the top 4 as they have no strike in the centres and you need strike in the centres in the modern game. Put a line through them. That is what Ennis actually said.
3) Someone on here I think Frank White said the only stat that matters is two points from the victory. OK let's run with that.
2024 centres
Pompey Won 6 Lost 8 = 43 % winning record
Berry Won 4 Lost 7 Drew 1 = 33% winning record
CNK Insufficient data only 1 game at centre
Ali Won 3 Lost 3 = 50% winning record
RTS Won 2 Lost 10 Drew 1 = 15% winning record

My humble view is we can't pick the centres based on who is the best defensively. It should be based on a balance of who is good at both defence and offence.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

2) Sure granted Pompey and Rocco got us to the playoffs last year - were you aware that Ennis singled them out in his pre playoffs predictions last year. The Warriors will absolutely not win the premiership in 2023 despite finishing in the top 4 as they have no strike in the centres and you need strike in the centres in the modern game. Put a line through them. That is what Ennis actually said.

Very interesting point. Is it to do with how much pressure is put on the halves? I’m assuming teams are much less inclined to jam against teams with gun centres….

 

[Wrighty]

Very interesting point. Is it to do with how much pressure is put on the halves? I’m assuming teams are much less inclined to jam against teams with gun centres….

Not sure but Centres get a lot of possession over 80 minutes.

 

[Stalefish540]

It's madness led by two or three heavyweight forum posters. He is still an oustanding player. There would be very few teams who would not take him if offered him.
He just needs the right position. Despite those stats I can't recall him creating anything offensively at centre.
Wing is an important position which gets many touches in league. Put him on wing with Montoya first reserve. RTS and Dallin get injured so much Montoya will get at least 14-15 games.

I'd be more than happy to see a trimmed down RTS on the left wing next season.

We don't have a stack of out and out wingers at the club, I'd rather see RTS with a full pre-season at left wing, but just don't have him anywhere near centre. We simply can't start next season with Montoya on the left wing if we are serious about winning games in 2025.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

To clarify one final time.

For the first 3 rounds. I STRESS, 3 rounds.
I would prefer a safer, more defensive approach. There for, Pompey and Rocco get the job to begin with. With Ali right on their heels.

Funny thing is I agree with a lot of what people are saying, I’m just prioritising defence over offence.
Thing is, Pompey and Rocco aren’t hopeless on attack, Pompey especially who’s had some very good games against the “elite” centres of the league. Yes Ali is better offensively than both.

If a balanced approach of offence and defence is the way forward. Then Pompey is a lock……

We’re just going to have to agree to disagree on that.

I can’t see Andrew Webster picking a backline of.

1. Taine
2. RTS
3. Ali
4. CNK
5. DWZ
6. Metcalf
7. TTM

I suppose stranger things have happened in this world.

It ain’t nothing but passion anyway team. We all want the same thing at the end of the day.