Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[wizard of Tauranga]

I don’t think anyone wants to drag up the covid thread again.

It was an unprecedented time in our history. A lot of different views that people are very passionate about with tunnel vision.

On one side people are happy that lives, including their own were saved and nothing will change their minds. That’s pretty powerful.

On the other side careers, jobs and businesses were wrecked and rights were walked over, rightly or wrongly for what was decided by the government was for a bigger cause. The Wellington protests show how powerful that was.

We could debate if it was all worth it but I don’t think we will get very far.

It’s also pointless dragging up what people said at the time until a true independent review is done of our covid response with facts about lives saved vs the impacts and weather the vaccination programme and mandates provided the benefits against the costs. It’s disingenuous to say either side is right or wrong - without that review, it’s just different opinions.

I think it’s telling the government has steered clear of a comprehensive review. It’s telling they have wanted Covid gone from the public conversation. Not because of right and wrong but because it’s so decisive. We should follow that lead…

I mean Winston was in the middle of it all and he was our deputy PM a few months before covid struck. Nobody’s having a go at what he said

 

[juju]

Saved approximately 11,000 lives.

Provided wage subsidies and covid relief packages...

But apparently windfall taxes on a sector making $7b net profit a year is unpalatable

But selling 1600 $2m houses per year in a housing crisis is the way to go.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

But selling 1600 $2m houses per year in a housing crisis is the way to go.

I don’t know why this is a problem. Homeless people aren’t buying/ living in $2m+ houses and Kiwibuild provided 10,000 houses a year doesn’t it? So the 1600 houses is chicken feed.

 

[juju]

I don’t think anyone wants to drag up the covid thread again.

It was an unprecedented time in our history. A lot of different views that people are very passionate about with tunnel vision.

On one side people are happy that lives, including their own were saved and nothing will change their minds. That’s pretty powerful.

On the other side careers, jobs and businesses were wrecked and rights were walked over, rightly or wrongly for what was decided by the government was for a bigger cause. The Wellington protests show how powerful that was.

We could debate if it was all worth it but I don’t think we will get very far.

It’s also pointless dragging up what people said at the time until a true independent review is done of our covid response with facts about lives saved vs the impacts and weather the vaccination programme and mandates provided the benefits against the costs. It’s disingenuous to say either side is right or wrong - without that review, it’s just different opinions.

I think it’s telling the government has steered clear of a comprehensive review. It’s telling they have wanted Covid gone from the public conversation. Not because of right and wrong but because it’s so decisive. We should follow that lead…

I mean Winston was in the middle of it all and he was our deputy PM a few months before covid struck. Nobody’s having a go at what he said

It was only raised in relation to your vapid post about would the government providing a "windfall" if in surplus.

The government provided an unprecedented safety net a really unprecedented time. The profitable business certainly didnt...

 

[juju]

I don’t know why this is a problem. Homeless people aren’t buying/ living in $2m+ houses and Kiwibuild provided 10,000 houses a year doesn’t it? So the 1600 houses is chicken feed.

Because of the flow on effects to the housing markets.
NZ only has 100 000 $2m houses.

In a recent poll only 9% support sales to non residents.

The Essential Report, New Zealand

The Essential Report is New Zealand's leading social and political poll. It tracks attitudes on everything from the economy, equality and the environment.

essentialreport.co.nz

This is not to mention, it's just a really stupid cornerstone election policy presented to the electorate like it's innovative - in a country with a housing affordability crisis.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Because of the flow on effects to the housing markets.
NZ only has 100 000 $2m houses.

In a recent poll only 9% support sales to non residents.

The Essential Report, New Zealand

The Essential Report is New Zealand's leading social and political poll. It tracks attitudes on everything from the economy, equality and the environment.

essentialreport.co.nz

This is not to mention, it's just a really stupid cornerstone election policy presented to the electorate like it's innovative - in a country with a housing affordability crisis.

Complain at a funeral wouldn’t you

I thought you lefties loved:

1 - more tax
2 - from the rich
3 - no sales to foreigners for under $2m houses

This could easily have been a Labour policy if they thought of it first and you would be applauding it!

1600 houses is nothing in an affordability crisis when the answer is to just build a shit load of new houses - which National has policies for. Those 1600 houses would house about 5,000 people when Labour has bought in 100,000 people this year… do you comprehend the insignificance of those 1600 houses, against the significance of Labour piling problems onto the housing crisis and requiring another 25,000 houses…

It’s not a cornerstone policy. It’s 1 of 4 new taxes + cost cuttings as part of the tax policy which is only part of a whole manifesto. Talk about making a big deal out of a few hundred million policy when Labour just cost us $29 billion by being out with their estimates in the last none months.

 

[juju]

Complain at a funeral wouldn’t you

I thought you lefties loved:

1 - more tax
2 - from the rich
3 - no sales to foreigners for under $2m houses

This could easily have been a Labour policy if they thought of it first and you would be applauding it!

1600 houses is nothing in an affordability crisis when the answer is to just build a shit load of new houses - which National has policies for. Those 1600 houses would house about 5,000 people when Labour has bought in 100,000 people this year… do you comprehend the insignificance of those 1600 houses, against the significance of Labour piling problems onto the housing crisis and requiring another 25,000 houses…

It’s not a cornerstone policy. It’s 1 of 4 new taxes + cost cuttings as part of the tax policy which is only part of a whole manifesto. Talk about making a big deal out of a few hundred million policy when Labour just cost us $29 billion by being out with their estimates in the last none months.

It's certainly is a cornerstone policy and dominating the election cycle.

The National Party 35 page finance document has whole pages taken up by photos of Luxon holding babies.

Do I think keeping the current status quo will solve housing issues alone? of course not

You understand a windfall tax on the banking sector alone (a tax policy that exists in numerous countries ) would bring in almost double the money without the possibility of disrupting housing?

But by your extremely nuanced well thought out take was- a windfall tax would never work because the government won't offer a windfall back business in surplus.
I thought you were smart...

And a few hundred million in one policy is a big deal - especially when a party is electioneering on being "strong economic manager" How many policies are costed so badly - You think the fluoride MP is going to turn the country around.

 

[juju]

Why does Seymour's hypocrisy remind me of our residents right wingers views in this thread.

 

[Lord Gnome of Mooloolaba]

I don’t know why this is a problem. Homeless people aren’t buying/ living in $2m+ houses and Kiwibuild provided 10,000 houses a year doesn’t it? So the 1600 houses is chicken feed.

If voting required an IQ test the right wouldn't stand a chance.

 

[dean]

. Those 1600 houses would house about 5,000 people when Labour has bought in 100,000 people this year… do you comprehend the insignificance of those 1600 houses, against the significance of Labour piling problems onto the housing crisis and requiring another 25,000 houses…

You are miles out in your calculations for new housing needed to meet Labours 100,000 new immigrants.
They have thoroughly crunched the numbers and found they will need hardly any additional houses given 38 new immigrants will ocupy a three bedroom home. This is not allowing for the garage or closing off the carport which will bring the number up to around 50 per house.

 

[defensivebomb]

The 15% tax will apply to houses that are worth more than $2m.

Foreigner buys a house worth $2,000,000 = pay $2,000,000
Foreigner buys a house worth $2,000,001 = pay $2,300,001

So, if you are a foreigner, you are probably only really interested in buying a house in NZ at the $3m+ category.

The reason being - why would you pay $2.3m for something that is clearly only worth $2m?

At the $3m+ level, "market value" becomes a lot more subjective.

At the $2m level, it is fairly easy to find market comparables.

$740m of annual tax revenue = 1,000 x $5m house sales per year to foreigners

Personally, I can see the first year or two of revenue being achieved, as pent up foreign demand comes back to the market. Any more than those first few years would probably require a fair bit of house price inflation to counteract the pent up demand disappearing

 

[dean]

Gang hikoi starting in Northland and ending at Parliament starting today. Reported that it is to oppose National and Act policies on tougher sentencing for gangs. Gangs stand strongly with the left, a very good reason not to vote for them.

 

[dean]

Don't you support the gang's with your weed habit though?

Me getting stoned sometimes has nothing to do with supporting gangs. If you apply that logic, the majority of the adult population would be supporting gangs.

 

[Woofa]

I follow multiple sources with my main one probably being the NZ herald. Most stuff I link is from there. They are slightly left but the most central of the media sources according to the graph posted here a couple of pages back.

Probably NZ best resourced, balanced and creditable paper?

Where do you get your news from @juju?

Coming at this late but I find them incredibly left leaning and utter waffle now (like its very obvious they are pro labour and the media fund they were dished out). I read the sports and that's about it. Your right though miles ahead of stuff and newshub but who really reads that crap.

 

[John Nick]

Coming at this late but I find them incredibly left leaning and utter waffle now (like its very obvious they are pro labour and the media fund they were dished out). I read the sports and that's about it. Your right though miles ahead of stuff and newshub but who really reads that crap.

The debate tonight will be interesting to see how JMM handles the candidates and if they both get a fair go.

 

[defensivebomb]

Gang hikoi starting in Northland and ending at Parliament starting today. Reported that it is to oppose National and Act policies on tougher sentencing for gangs. Gangs stand strongly with the left, a very good reason not to vote for them.

Haha that’s actually quite funny

I can imagine Chris Hipkins peeking through the curtains at the beehive, seeing the hikoi approaching and thinking "oh f*ck me"

 

[Possum11]

The leaders debate: Most people have already decided who they want to vote for either your a Hopkins or Luxon fan it's Presidental now

 

[defensivebomb]

The debate tonight will be interesting to see how JMM handles the candidates and if they both get a fair go.

I can't stand JMM. She has a habit of chewing up airtime and not offering anything insightful that couldn't be worked out by the viewer on their own

 

[Inruin]

I can't stand JMM. She has a habit of chewing up airtime and not offering anything insightful that couldn't be worked out by the viewer on their own

How is she even moderating the debate? Surely better options out there.

 

[Noitall]

How is she even moderating the debate? Surely better options out there.

Should be Jack Tame.