Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[Damo]

2021 it was $105b; 2023 it was $150b.

This is an increase of 42% in 3 years or 14% per year. Well above inflation and population growth.

Not sure if I am misinterpreting your graph, but 2021 was 130B

 

[miket12]

Sounds like you’ve had a visit from your neighbour Mike

Nah, ex brother-in-law who loved trains (and underaged girls which led to him becoming an "ex brother-in-law") told me a few years ago. He also was pretty high up in the Nats... another reason I wouldn't vote for them again.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Not sure why y'all dogpiling on Top8. Why is it up to him to produce receipts for every comment he makes? Like if he's wrong, can't y'all produce a receipt of your own to say he's wrong?

I think it's disingenuous to ask for a start date. The moment they announced they "wanted" to build one and hired consultants was the start date imo.

Edit: a lot of these discussions require nuance and good faith reciprocation

Because that's how they roll, thanks Tyrael though

Yeah, there's a huge amount of depth and nuance.

 

[MaybeTop8]

It's disingenuous to claim the coalition is destroying public transport and use cancelling light rail as the reason for the statement, claiming it was just about to start. Asking for that start date shouldn't be particularly onerous. I asked about funding as well because it wasn't included, as far as I am aware, in Labours budgets which I would conclude backs up that there isn't a solid start date

Simeon Brown has been conducting an ideological war https://www.greaterauckland.org.nz/2025/01/20/can-we-have-a-normal-minister-of-transport-now/

And the National party have been anti public transport since forever.

Act are even worse. The road lobbies are demanding their return on their donations.

This coalition have deliberately chosen roads over all else, and cut funding everywhere apart from roads.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Cut funding. Manufacture crises. Blame the previous government. Sell off to the lowest bidder.

Of the rich, for the rich, by the rich.

 

[Inruin]

Simeon Brown has been conducting an ideological war https://www.greaterauckland.org.nz/2025/01/20/can-we-have-a-normal-minister-of-transport-now/

And the National party have been anti public transport since forever.

Act are even worse. The road lobbies are demanding their return on their donations.

This coalition have deliberately chosen roads over all else, and cut funding everywhere apart from roads.

Mate, just stop. I know you don't like them but you just can't make stuff up and claim it's true.

I literally just posted a link to the CEO of Kiwirail talking about the governments investment in rail.

The Government’s $466 million Budget 2024 investment in rail highlights a commitment to reliable public transport in Auckland and Wellington and supporting export growth nationally, KiwiRail Chief Executive Peter Reidy says.

Budget 2024 rail investment supports reliability and value for money

www.kiwirail.co.nz

 

[Inruin]

Cut funding. Manufacture crises. Blame the previous government. Sell off to the lowest bidder.

Of the rich, for the rich, by the rich.

Chem trails, 5g chips, they buried the bodies in the woods!

 

[MaybeTop8]

Mate, just stop. I know you don't like them but you just can't make stuff up and claim it's true.

I literally just posted a link to the CEO of Kiwirail talking about the governments investment in rail.

The Government’s $466 million Budget 2024 investment in rail highlights a commitment to reliable public transport in Auckland and Wellington and supporting export growth nationally, KiwiRail Chief Executive Peter Reidy says.

Budget 2024 rail investment supports reliability and value for money

www.kiwirail.co.nz

Mate just stop. I know you don't like what you're seeing in this current coalition.

They want to scrap ferries that carry rail.

Here's the 2023 budget - 569.2 million

And the 2022 budget - 661.5 million

So the funding has decreased dramatically.






Anyway, it's a nice day, later.

 

[Inruin]

Mate just stop. I know you don't like what you're seeing in this current coalition.

They want to scrap ferries that carry rail.

Here's the 2023 budget - 569.2 million

And the 2022 budget - 661.5 million

So the funding has decreased dramati

View attachment 11484

Anyway, it's a nice day, later.

So, one off investment in locomotives and freight wagons in 2022 and a one off boost to help the recovery from Extreme Weather in 2023. So, the budget for 2024 has more relative investment in the rail network.

Hardly a smoking gun against public transport now is it?

 

[MrFrankWhite]

This government is incapable of the foresight for infrastructure projects and our country has forgotten how to build anything because successive fishnets turn the tap on and off and privatize everything.
The ministry of works might have been lambasted when it existed but it got a hell of a lot more done than we get now and at better quality. Without long term thinking and budgeting don't bother, you will just flush more money down the drain.

haha what has NZ built since the Clyde dam?

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Labour increased the top personal tax rate from 33% to 39%

Labour increased the trust tax rate from 28% to 39%

Didn’t index tax rates during massive inflation effectively forcing middle income earners to pay high tax rates.

They also increased the brightline, introduced a renters tax, ute tax, petrol taxes, climate change taxes, etc

Overall Tax has increased from in $90b to $150b in just 6 years. Income as a percentage of the economy increased from about 28% to 32% (sizeable increase).

Labour themselves have stated they believe in a higher tax, higher govt spend economy. This has all been discussed before. Your sounding like a troll trying to spread misinformation…

View attachment 11481

oofft. big facts

 

[Noitall]

Nah, ex brother-in-law who loved trains (and underaged girls which led to him becoming an "ex brother-in-law") told me a few years ago. He also was pretty high up in the Nats... another reason I wouldn't vote for them again.

Sounds like it might be entrenched in the party historically

 

[Worried2Death]

Sounds like it might be entrenched in the party historically

Seems to be entrenched in the train enthusiast community too, they're as bad as priests and pastors. Model trains, that is.

 

[Worried2Death]

So labour and the left are of the rich, by the rich, for the rich by your logic?

Haven't they been neoliberal too by most definitions since Douglas/Lange? Neolib light maybe.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Haven't they been neoliberal too by most definitions since Douglas/Lange? Neolib light maybe.

Isn’t neoliberalism basically just market driven and capitalist economies? Is there any real alternative?

Don’t tel me some on here are pushing for centrally planned?

What’s the alternative @MaybeTop8? You have still never said. Are we talking a forum communist?

 

[Worried2Death]

Isn’t neoliberalism basically just market driven and capitalist economies? Is there any real alternative?

Don’t tel me some on here are pushing for centrally planned?

What’s the alternative @MaybeTop8? You have still never said. Are we talking a forum communist?

Depends whether you think pure capitalism should have any restraints and what they should be I spose

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Depends whether you think pure capitalism should have any restraints and what they should be I spose

That’s just tweaking and working within capitalism. There will always be debates about the limits and boundaries. It’s not a completely different system like some are suggesting.

Capitalism and market driven systems are about the individual. They have freed individuals to have such benefits as gay marriages; feminism; equal rights, etc. Increased individual productivity and individual health.

None of these things you would get under other systems.

 

[Worried2Death]

That’s just tweaking and working within capitalism. There will always be debates about the limits and boundaries. It’s not a completely different system like some are suggesting.

Capitalism and market driven systems are about the individual. They have freed individuals to have such benefits as gay marriages; feminism; equal rights, etc. Increased individual productivity and individual health.

None of these things you would get under other systems.

Maybe we just haven't perfected the ultimate utopia where everyone can be gay and get a fair share of the capital. I think I just wrote a Billý Bragg song.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Maybe we just haven't perfected the ultimate utopia where everyone can be gay and get a fair share of the capital

If we’re promoting the individual we can never be equal. Different concepts.

But we’re all better off than any planned economy in history…

 

[Worried2Death]

If we’re promoting the individual we can never be equal. Different concepts.

But we’re all better off than any planned economy in history…

Weren't the Wall St bailouts an act of central planning to prevent the capitalist system from collapsing? The whole house of cards is a throne of lies.