Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[Mr. Brownstone]

Better off if the tax take was evenly distributed across society

Not sure what your point is there, however I’m obviously all for escalating tax brackets.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

Not all, and housing would be cheaper. And the tax take would be fairer.

What tax take?

 

[marv.]

He will know exactly which employees are sick, are mentally struggling, he will have access to all medical records, all personal information. He will know everything about that employee, about all employees.

doubt it.
if he’s such a horrible villain why would he possibly give a fuck about his employees personal information or welfare?
surely if they’re such low value workers, they’re easily interchangeable?

if i were a billionaire, i’d be far more concerned with how much cocaine, cocktails, and pussy i can peel through on my superyacht.

 

[dean]

if i were a billionaire, i’d be far more concerned with how much cocaine, cocktails, and pussy i can peel through on my superyacht.

That's why I stopped at a millionaire.

 

[Noitall]

Not sure what your point is there, however I’m obviously all for escalating tax brackets.

Just that a portion of the wealthiest don’t pay a same percentage as most in society. Though largely inflating his wealth and power in his mind, people like Donald Trump openly gloat about it to know it is in fact the case. Just saying that if it was an even for all percentage, our economy would be better off. Not to discount anything that’s contributed by those that can afford it. There’s even a part of society that can afford that want to pay more in taxes, those that David Seymour labels grandstanders. As people say though, there’s nothing to stop those that can and are willing to donate to where needed

 

[MrFrankWhite]

And let's look at what else he's looking to set up - he employs the psychologists - he will own the content of those sessions. He will know exactly which employees are sick, are mentally struggling, he will have access to all medical records, all personal information. He will know everything about that employee, about all employees.

This is the most factually incorrect bullshit Ive seen you spout and considering its you, thats a massive feat. Even the Department of Defence doesn't have private ownership of private health records and they own and maintain a $10B private healthcare system.

The notion that you could employ psychologists and therefore own peoples health records is the most fanciful nonsense of all time.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

Just that a portion of the wealthiest don’t pay a same percentage as most in society. Though largely inflating his wealth and power in his mind, people like Donald Trump openly gloat about it to know it is in fact the case. Just saying that if it was an even for all percentage, our economy would be better off. Not to discount anything that’s contributed by those that can afford it. There’s even a part of society that can afford that want to pay more in taxes, those that David Seymour labels grandstanders. As people say though, there’s nothing to stop those that can and are willing to donate to where needed

Oh right - something like billionaires only paying 9% tax aye? I haven’t looked into how that works, but obviously once you reach that status of wealth you aren’t on a typical wage Anyway the couple I’ve come across are remarkable people that contribute enormously positively to society.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Oh right - something like billionaires only paying 9% tax aye? I haven’t looked into how that works, but obviously once you reach that status of wealth you aren’t on a typical wage Anyway the couple I’ve come across are remarkable people that contribute enormously positively to society.

Hate to say it too but I used to be a brain dead lefty hating on billionaires. But its just envy politics. Judge people on their contribution.

Gina Rhinehart is despised by Aussie lefties. Problem is, is she is one of the very few genuinely independently wealthy women in the world. she inherited a company 100M in debt from her father, staved of bankruptcy and turned into 3billion. She employs 1000s of Aussies and when the fed govt stopped funding swimming Asutralia, she stepped in and coughs up like 10m a year. (check the Aussies swimmers recent medal tally )

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

Hate to say it too but I used to be a brain dead lefty hating on billionaires. But its just envy politics. Judge people on their contribution.

Gina Rhinehart is despised by Aussie lefties. Problem is is she is one of the very few genuinely independently wealthy women in the world. she inherited a company 100M in debt from her father, staved of bankruptcy and turned into into 3billion. She employs 1000s of Aussies and when the fed govt stopped funding swimming Asutralia, she stepped in and coughs up like 10m a year. (check the Aussies swimmers recent medal tally )

Twiggy Forest is highly controversial however I recall one of my colleagues being convinced by him to go check out a piece of land in the Pilbara many years ago that we ultimately invested in. At that stage it was just red dirt however it became Fortescue, & Twiggy built that business despite everyone imaginable, including the majors BHP & Rio Tinto saying he was crazy & it wasn’t going to work. Risk & reward.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

And by the way, for those of you deluded enough to think all these billionaires are bad people. What about the huge tax that the companies they built are paying? The people they employ and their philanthropic community endeavours. Sure none of them are perfect, many are indeed narcissists, some will no doubt be total cunts, however you get them across all classes of society. However many are also visionaries and should in my opinion be celebrated.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Twiggy Forest is highly controversial however I recall one of my colleagues being convinced by him to go check out a piece of land in the Pilbara many years ago that we ultimately invested in. At that stage it was just red dirt however it became Fortescue, & Twiggy built that business despite everyone imaginable, including the majors BHP & Rio Tinto saying he was crazy & it wasn’t going to work. Risk & reward.

Twiggy is a scumbag. But was for a long time, a very shrewd scumbag. He has mastered the art of milking his political connections for personal gain. His current pursuit of green hydrogen being a prime example. Fortescue has been an ASX beast for a while now. $FMG investors are a special breed.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

Twiggy is a scumbag. But was for a long time, a very shrewd scumbag. He has mastered the art of milking his political connections for personal gain. His current pursuit of green hydrogen being a prime example. Fortescue has been an ASX beast for a while now. $FMG investors are a special breed.

Think it was around 2006 we bought in. Took a bit of convincing to even get across to see the dirt because his track record was not good!

 

[marv.]

And by the way, for those of you deluded enough to think all these billionaires are bad people. What about the huge tax that the companies they built are paying? The people they employ and their philanthropic community endeavours. Sure none of them are perfect, many are indeed narcissists, some will no doubt be total cunts, however you get them across all classes of society. However many are also visionaries and should in my opinion be celebrated.

i’ve never seen bernard hickey say that, none of it could possibly be true.

 

[miket12]

Okay. So it's falling on the usual partisan lines, where the right and further right commenters on here all fall into line and get all righteous about defending the rights of the poor billionaires (while I'm dishing out the hyperbole let's add in the poor landlords and multimillionaires in need of those tax cuts). Fair enough. So far so predictable.

Let's ignore the loss of worker's rights eh? Let's ignore the fact that many businesses would have gone under if it wasn't for the workers during covid and their adaptability to be able to work from home, work on the front line eh, that's not important because that doesn't matter right?

I work from home four days a week in a city that is impossible to get anywhere, otherwise known as Auckland. You call it a privilege but I make sure I work my 8 hours, and I often work more. Many of my colleagues are the same, and this is common in many of the other industries that I have worked in. Our offices (i.t., banking, finance, insurance, television, telecomms) are pared back to only allow usually around 2/3rds of staff to attend at any one time, and it's all hot desking. They WANT and indeed NEED people to work from home.

And the employers don't pay for water, rates, electricity, toilet paper or anything else that you might need. Nope, they get all that for free.

In case you hadn't noticed, billionaires around the world are actively working to dismantle democracies and wind back human rights. OUR rights. All of us - on here, of all political stripes - our rights. Billionaires including assholes like this guy. We're regressing towards serfdom if we allow this to happen. Human rights are hard fought, and hard won for, and easily taken away, and we are witnessing this at a great rate of knots in the race to a low wage economy with higher unemployment, the contraction of decent journalism that holds people to account, all neolib tactics to enrich the already wealthy.

So come on you predictable commenters, let's not pretend this guy is even remotely altruistic.

There's other aspects and context that isn't being addressed - like control, and power. Like the fact this guy is effectively saying "I own you, you are my personal slaves and you will do what I tell you". The fact that he is openly stating he wants to restrict an individual's freedom of movement. That's called authoritarianism. That's fascist in nature. That's a violation of basic human rights.

Yes, yes, the eye rolling is loud, I hear the howls of "BUT THEY DON'T HAVE TO WORK THERE!!!! HE'S SO BENEVOLENT!! THE WORKERS ARE JUST GREEDY AND SELFISH!!!". But look at his own words
View attachment 9011

This is who he is. This is who the billionaires are. Not all I'm sure, but there's quite a few who are actively wanting to fuck over everyone else and the planet RIGHT NOW. Of the rich, by the rich, for the rich. Like this government (I had to get that in, I'm equally predictable)

And let's look at what else he's looking to set up - he employs the psychologists - he will own the content of those sessions. He will know exactly which employees are sick, are mentally struggling, he will have access to all medical records, all personal information. He will know everything about that employee, about all employees.

Because He Owns You. That's where this is heading. You will say, "Oh that's bullshit", go back and read his words. His intent. It's pushing boundaries, and that's deliberate on his part.

And like most on the right there are the fictional claims with no facts that start this - the dead cat strategy - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_cat_strategy#:~:text=3 See also-,Origin,facts are overwhelmingly against you". He offers no proof that people are working from home 3 days a week and claiming 5 days pay.

Because it's not about that. It's about the fact that there's a climate now where he's dipping his toes in the water and he's testing out if he can get away with the beginning of what he REALLY wants to happen - complete control and ownership. It's taking us back to the dark ages. No surprises either that this has come from a mining magnate who rampantly destroys the environment (yes that's a partial dog whistle.)

I find it odd that some on here are okay with this, but there's been a pattern of defending ideologically along a battleline without addressing the content, so I shouldn't really be surprised. I'm not okay with it at all, just in case you're wondering.

Have a great day everyone, enjoy the weekend, up the wahs, and here's hoping Webby has an amazing offseason with some excellent new tactics.

Nice piece of creative writing. Because I show that the story from one organisation didn't show parts of the how he looks after his employees, I'm "defending the billionaires" when in fact I was showing the lack of balance in the stuff article.

Oh, and guess what... employees would have the choice of whether or not to use the medical facilities provided. And, of course, you've completely ignored the fact that medical records are confidential... there is no one any medical or counselling staff would share anything said in a consultation with an employee with the boss or give him access to private medical records.... they would lose their medical licenses!!!

But like I said, nice piece of creative writing.

 

[MaybeTop8]

You lot are hilarious. Ideologically stagnant. Hilarious though.

 

[Worried2Death]

You lot are hilarious. Ideologically stagnant. Hilarious though.

You have to admit that was a bit of a ragebait headline by some Stuff editor though. I presume Ellison saying he wants to hold them captive was some kind of sardonic joke in context.

 

[MaybeTop8]

You have to admit that was a bit of a ragebait headline by some Stuff editor though. I presume Ellison saying he wants to hold them captive was some kind of sardonic joke in context.

Nah, he's testing the waters to gage the reaction imo

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

You lot are hilarious. Ideologically stagnant. Hilarious though.

We’ll suck it up because our ideology is reality.

 

[John Nick]

You have to admit that was a bit of a ragebait headline by some Stuff editor though. I presume Ellison saying he wants to hold them captive was some kind of sardonic joke in context.

Perhaps his idea of a joke is ill conceived

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Better off if the tax take was evenly distributed across society

‘The study, done for tax consultancy OliverShaw, has concluded the rich in New Zealand paid most of the tax collected, and the higher their income the more they paid; while the least well-paid often effectively ended up paying less because of the various tax credits and other payments they received.’


So if the tax take was more even, the rich pay less instead of all of it and the poor (that are heavily subsidised) pay more than they can afford?

Labour and the Greens need to be honest that tax arguments are just about taking more from the rich, not fairness.

Rich paying their fair share of tax, study concludes

But the tax system is "getting very, very strained at the edges", says the head of the company behind it.

www.rnz.co.nz