Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[wizard of Tauranga]

Something that Luxon should have considered before getting bent over

Stepping back a bit, this is MMP.

Since we had MMP, minor coalition partners have always lost support by the next election due to being partnered with a bigger partner.

The only way for ACT, NZ First, Greens and Maori party to survive government is to get a few issues that their voters love and blow them up to a big issue to define yourself. Look at NZ First and Act taking extreme views. Look at the Maori party doing the same at the opposite side.

MMP has created Trump style politics on the fringes. Evidence at every election is that it’s what must be done as a minor party to retain voters.

 

[John Nick]

Usually the bigger the backlash the more they are hitting the button.

I believe Maori don’t want to debate it and are pushing so hard because Seymour’s referendum would get backed by the silent majority. I believe private polling shows this

Wouldn’t surprise me if the rights support grows!

(I’ve said on here I support the idea but think it’s to divisive to be a priority and should be dropped)

Luxon obviously agrees with you but went along with it to become PM.

 

[John Nick]

Stepping back a bit, this is MMP.

Since we had MMP, minor coalition partners have always lost support by the next election due to being partnered with a bigger partner.

The only way for ACT, NZ First, Greens and Maori party to survive government is to get a few issues that their voters love and blow them up to a big issue to define yourself. Look at NZ First and Act taking extreme views. Look at the Maori party doing the same at the opposite side.

MMP has created Trump style politics on the fringes. Evidence at every election is that it’s what must be done as a minor party to retain voters.

Do you think that's a good thing
We now have a guy like Jones making huge decisions about infrastructure and industry development who is a list member of a party who got approx.6%

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Do you think that's a good thing

No. I wouldn’t vote for MMP again.

It does increase minor voices but forces them to go extreme to survive.

No winners there.

Our politics have become divisive with massive swings from left to right instead of minor central fluctuations.

 

[Inruin]

Usually the bigger the backlash the more they are hitting the button.

I believe Maori don’t want to debate it and are pushing so hard because Seymour’s referendum would get backed by the silent majority. I believe private polling shows this

Wouldn’t surprise me if the rights support grows!

(I’ve said on here I support the idea but think it’s to divisive to be a priority and should be dropped)

The saving grace might be that it will be done and dusted by mid next year and Luxon and Peters can say they did as they promised, it was important to Act to get it out there and they supported it past it's first reading and that's as far as it goes. The alternative was a Labour/Greens/Maori coalition. The left block talked about a three headed monster, but can't help think that description would have been far more apt for themselves. By election time it will likely be overshadowed by either better results in health, education, crime and the economy or poor results in those areas.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

By election time it will likely be overshadowed by either better results in health, education, crime and the economy or poor results in those areas.

This always wins/ loses elections.

The political games are just entertainment

 

[Noitall]

The saving grace might be that it will be done and dusted by mid next year and Luxon and Peters can say they did as they promised, it was important to Act to get it out there and they supported it past it's first reading and that's as far as it goes. The alternative was a Labour/Greens/Maori coalition. The left block talked about a three headed monster, but can't help think that description would have been far more apt for themselves. By election time it will likely be overshadowed by either better results in health, education, crime and the economy or poor results in those areas.

'Very simplistic': Luxon pushes back against Seymour ahead of Treaty Principles Bill vote

The contentious bill will have its first reading in Parliament this afternoon.

www.nzherald.co.nz

Problem is there’s a division growing between Luxon and Seymour. Can’t imagine that Seymour won’t bite back around Luxon’s simplistic comment being the type he is

 

[defensivebomb]

I went for a run yesterday in / around the hikoi

The supporters there were pretty chill

I do find it cringe when the same old greens hijack a movement to ride the current woke wave. They were notably silent during the many decades of atrocities in the Middle East. But taking a stance on Gaza these days is the thing to it seems. An old school friend is on my Facebook with shots of whatever antiestablishment protest he’s on. A few years back it was unions, Greenpeace, etc. Now it is the treaty / gang patches / gaza. Leftist fashion trends. They wear social issues like Louis Vuitton

In any case, I have no beef with the march. Would be good if they kept it purely about the bill, rather than dilute it with other issues as there are plenty of muppets that trot out to any protest

 

[Rizzah]

Interesting projection graph from UN IDO - The Future of Industrialisation report.
Looks like China is the economy to get behind.

 

[John Nick]

'Very simplistic': Luxon pushes back against Seymour ahead of Treaty Principles Bill vote

The contentious bill will have its first reading in Parliament this afternoon.

www.nzherald.co.nz

Problem is there’s a division growing between Luxon and Seymour. Can’t imagine that Seymour won’t bite back around Luxon’s simplistic comment being the type he is

And Winnie is not to be heard anywhere

 

[Inruin]

'Very simplistic': Luxon pushes back against Seymour ahead of Treaty Principles Bill vote

The contentious bill will have its first reading in Parliament this afternoon.

www.nzherald.co.nz

Problem is there’s a division growing between Luxon and Seymour. Can’t imagine that Seymour won’t bite back around Luxon’s simplistic comment being the type he is

He already has by claiming National and NZF are afraid of making the big calls. Luxon has replied the best way I think by redirecting people to their main focus being inflation, cost of living, the economy, health education and crime.

 

[Inruin]

I went for a run yesterday in / around the hikoi

The supporters there were pretty chill

I do find it cringe when the same old greens hijack a movement to ride the current woke wave. They were notably silent during the many decades of atrocities in the Middle East. But taking a stance on Gaza these days is the thing to it seems. An old school friend is on my Facebook with shots of whatever antiestablishment protest he’s on. A few years back it was unions, Greenpeace, etc. Now it is the treaty / gang patches / gaza. Leftist fashion trends. They wear social issues like Louis Vuitton

In any case, I have no beef with the march. Would be good if they kept it purely about the bill, rather than dilute it with other issues as there are plenty of muppets that trot out to any protest

The other piece I find a bit cringe is using the line 'for our mokopuna' yet very quiet when there continues to be the baby Ru's happening in NZ and one of the worst records of child abuse in the world

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

'Very simplistic': Luxon pushes back against Seymour ahead of Treaty Principles Bill vote

The contentious bill will have its first reading in Parliament this afternoon.

www.nzherald.co.nz

Problem is there’s a division growing between Luxon and Seymour. Can’t imagine that Seymour won’t bite back around Luxon’s simplistic comment being the type he is

You know when celebrities have fake grudges against each other as a marketing ploy…

Taylor Swift and Katy Perry bad blood vibes

 

[Noitall]

He already has by claiming National and NZF are afraid of making the big calls. Luxon has replied the best way I think by redirecting people to their main focus being inflation, cost of living, the economy, health education and crime.

Tricky for Luxon not being from the political world, even though I’m sure the corporate world is cutthroat, the political world has much more to do with many other things like perception for example. Luxon still has a half term with Seymour deputy pm yet

 

[John Nick]

Tricky for Luxon not being from the political world, even though I’m sure the corporate world is cutthroat, the political world has much more to do with many other things like perception for example. Luxon still has a half term with Seymour deputy pm yet

Got what he wanted tho

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

The other piece I find a bit cringe is using the line 'for our mokopuna' yet very quiet when there continues to be the baby Ru's happening in NZ and one of the worst records of child abuse in the world

Honestly, if Maori put as much effort into the education system and educational outcomes for Maori kids, it would have a much more meaningful impact on Maori outcomes.

There should be protests about the numbers of kids not attending schools, our dropping literacy and numeracy rates, etc

 

[Rizzah]

Aren’t they polluting the world? What about their human rights violations? Shouldn’t we be cutting back our relations with them?

You right wingers always putting money before the environment.

They are doing great things in the renewable space and EVs. The US has inadvertently helped build up a monster of industry.
They show a model of capitalism in a sort of socialist market economy that seems to work fairly well (but with an authoritarian govt) - I do wonder if you could have a similar model but with a democratic government.

 

[Inruin]

Tricky for Luxon not being from the political world, even though I’m sure the corporate world is cutthroat, the political world has much more to do with many other things like perception for example. Luxon still has a half term with Seymour deputy pm yet

I think Luxon has actually done fairly well managing the three parties. Many were predicting a complete disaster yet they have been very much unified. Yes there is the treaty bit with Act which seems like the only contentious policy between them. The half term with Seymour as DP is a concern though. I wonder if Luxon is getting as many of his overseas visits out of the way while Peters is DP so to not leave Seymour in charge for any length of time

 

[John Nick]

Honestly, if Maori put as much effort into the education system and educational outcomes for Maori kids, it would have a much more meaningful impact on Maori outcomes.

There should be protests about the numbers of kids not attending schools, our dropping literacy and numeracy rates, etc

Everyone goes to the ballot box promising to fix the problem and blames the other parties for not solving the problem
Luxon is not innocent of doing the same but says he was elected because the people wanted change.
Nothing much has changed

 

[Rizzah]

No. I wouldn’t vote for MMP again.

It does increase minor voices but forces them to go extreme to survive.

No winners there.

Our politics have become divisive with massive swings from left to right instead of minor central fluctuations.

MMP isn't the problem, it's successive govts failing to fix the issues. If the major parties were good for the majority the minor parties wouldn't have a shit show. But they're weak, lack vision and have mostly weak policy that doesn't address structural issues within NZ.