Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[John Nick]

Though three waters was unpopular at least it was an acknowledgement that something does need to change. It’s like that old saying of expecting the same old practice with a different outcome insane.

Couldn't be more obvious with what is happening in our swimming areas that something has to be done.
Local bodies are obviously not the answer.
This is not a recent issue.
Labour tried to get the ball rolling but it was unpalatable to many.
Especially the groups who had been irresponsible and ineffective in the past

 

[miket12]

Dam, what have I been missing…

Will, to start with, the Beatles broke up and Elvis permanently left the building.

 

[John Nick]

Will, to start with, the Beatles broke up and Elvis permanently left the building.

And don't forget Bruce.
Bruce left the building also

 

[miket12]

Local, regional or central government isn’t going to stop the idiots who decide that their soakholes aren’t working anymore so, instead of getting new ones, connect their downpipes and cesspits to the sanitary/wastewater drains. When it rains too heavily, the council’s pumpstations get overwhelmed and sewerage gets discharged into harbours and beaches through pipes that should only be discharging stormwater.

Go to most Northshore beaches after a large volume of rain and you’ll see brown water around the discharge pipes.

 

[Inruin]

You will probably find it’s tied back the other way and the council has borrowed against Watercare’s income so hard to unlink

If that is the case, having it transferred to a central body would impact councils even further wouldn't it?

 

[John Nick]

Local, regional or central government isn’t going to stop the idiots who decide that their soakholes aren’t working anymore so, instead of getting new ones, connect their downpipes and cesspits to the sanitary/wastewater drains. When it rains too heavily, the council’s pumpstations get overwhelmed and sewerage gets discharged into harbours and beaches through pipes that should only be discharging stormwater.

Go to most Northshore beaches after a large volume of rain and you’ll see brown water around the discharge pipes.

I presume that you are not happy with the situation

 

[Inruin]

Though three waters was unpopular at least it was an acknowledgement that something does need to change. It’s like that old saying of expecting the same old practice with a different outcome insane.

Most of the councils recognise that change is needed. But that also didn't mean that the proposed changes were the best way forward. When even Phil Goff can't support it you know it may not have been the best proposal.

 

[John Nick]

Most of the councils recognise that change is needed. But that also didn't mean that the proposed changes were the best way forward.

If you are right and I suspect you are why haven't councils acted on the issue before.
If Central government is going to put the ball back in local government hands what will change

 

[Noitall]

Most of the councils recognise that change is needed. But that also didn't mean that the proposed changes were the best way forward. When even Phil Goff can't support it you know it may not have been the best proposal.

But like the latest big sound bite goes, why throw the baby out with the bath water? Surely it was a decent base to start and tweaks could be made? Once again a huge waste of money from one administration taking over from another and we’re left with a poor service while blame is passed.

 

[miket12]

I presume that you are not happy with the situation

And the problem is, WaterCare could find the general areas it’s happening by doing inspections in manholes to see where there’s more “flow” than expected but there’s no desire to do that. So the pumps continue to be overwhelmed and wastewater continues to flow into the oceans.

 

[Noitall]

Will, to start with, the Beatles broke up and Elvis permanently left the building.

This is very upsetting and going to put a real dampener on new year celebrations for many. I for one was fond of their songs. I just hope that that John Lennon is careful, he can be a bit outspoken at times.

 

[John Nick]

And the problem is, WaterCare could find the general areas it’s happening by doing inspections in manholes to see where there’s more “flow” than expected but there’s no desire to do that. So the pumps continue to be overwhelmed and wastewater continues to flow into the oceans.

I was in Wellington in the 70's and during a storm storm water lids would pop out of the roads. Nothing has changed yet.

 

[Inruin]

But like the latest big sound bite goes, why throw the baby out with the bath water? Surely it was a decent base to start and tweaks could be made? Once again a huge waste of money from one administration taking over from another and we’re left with a poor service while blame is passed.

That's the problem though isn't it? It wasn't considered a good base to start from and was going to take time and money to get set up while there wasn't any great faith it would deliver better services

 

[John Nick]

That's the problem though isn't it? It wasn't considered a good base to start from and was going to take time and money to get set up while there wasn't any great faith it would deliver better services

The problem was councilors were thinking about themselves and not the public.
"Oh I might have to get off my arse and I want to keep my job"

 

[Inruin]

And the problem is, WaterCare could find the general areas it’s happening by doing inspections in manholes to see where there’s more “flow” than expected but there’s no desire to do that. So the pumps continue to be overwhelmed and wastewater continues to flow into the oceans.

Do you think Taumata Arowai will make a difference to this or anything at all. Looks like regulations will be backed up with stiff penalties?

 

[miket12]

I was in Wellington in the 70's and during a storm storm water lids would pop out of the roads. Nothing has changed yet.

And it’s gotten far worse when we’ve replaced 1/4 acre sections with 8 terraced houses so expecting stormwater pipes not designed to cope with that much impermeable/hard catchment without upgrading the pipework.

A few years ago, most of Manurewa and western Papatoetoe couldn’t be further subdivided because of lack of stormwater infrastructure. Now it can…. but the infrastructure for the Mahia Catchment hasn’t been upgraded. Instead, it all backs up and the same houses in Mangere keep getting flooded because that’s in a basin before the harbour.

 

[John Nick]

And it’s gotten far worse when we’ve replaced 1/4 acre sections with 8 terraced houses so expecting stormwater pipes not designed to cope with that much impermeable/hard catchment without upgrading the pipework.

A few years ago, most of Manurewa and western Papatoetoe couldn’t be further subdivided because of lack of stormwater infrastructure. Now it can…. but the infrastructure for the Mahia Catchment hasn’t been upgraded. Instead, it all backs up and the same houses in Mangere keep getting flooded because that’s in a basin before the harbour.

I agree miket12 but is doing nothing the answer.

 

[Noitall]

That's the problem though isn't it? It wasn't considered a good base to start from and was going to take time and money to get set up while there wasn't any great faith it would deliver better services

I feel like this is going to be similar to a CGT which labour were made to look the bad guys and years later we’re saying why don’t we have this?

 

[miket12]

Do you think Taumata Arowai will make a difference to this or anything at all. Looks like regulations will be backed up with stiff penalties?

From what I understand, Taunata Arowai will deal mostly with water suppliers and disposal along with large polluters such as industry and farmers. While the penalties will also include “small” polluters, I personally don’t think councils and water companies will have the staff or the will to go after house owners discharging waste or stormwater into the wrong pipe…. unless there‘s a catastrophe failure and it’s obvious on someone’s site what they’ve done. Easier to go after the “big boys” especially once economics of enforcement and prosecution come into it.

 

[Inruin]

I feel like this is going to be similar to a CGT which labour were made to look the bad guys and years later we’re saying why don’t we have this?

Possibly. But while nearly everyone seems to be in agreement that something needs to change, pushing ahead with something that had almost universal disapproval for a number of very valid reasons just for the sake of it doesn't seem the right thing either.