Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[Juno]

I think Charter schools have their place and don't think it is a waste of money. A recent overseas report where charter schools have been in place for longer showed them out performing the more traditional public system. The only ones who appeared to want them gone were Labour and surprise, surprise the teachers union. The problem we now have is that we have something that is different to mainstream, that helps particularly with māori and Pacific Islanders education but will be repealed when there is a change in government. That doesn't give certainly for these schools and would create a lot of changing back and forth over a relatively short period of time.

I'm old enough to remember when charter schools started to be given public monies. Prior to that they were predominitely church- based.
The average kiwi was outraged that such exclusive, privately-owned and supported schools (through rich and priviledged sectors like farmers - even though they were the most govt subsidised industries around) could partake of the limited public purse. Guess which de ile schools had to grin and bear reduced funding?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

I'm old enough to remember when charter schools started to be given public monies. Prior to that they were predominitely church- based.
The average kiwi was ouraged that such exclusive, privately-owned and supported schools (through rich and priveleged sectors like farmers - even though they were the most govt subsidised industries around) could partake of the limited public purse. Guess which de ile schools had to grin and bear reduced funding?

How much funding do they get?

All private schools get funding at the same rate as state schools. Is it more or less than that?

All schools in addition to operational funding get capital investment as well on a need basis. If it’s more than the operational of normal schools, was it for capital investment?

Personally just like health care or super, all children should get the same investment from the government - even home schooled kids get funding.

 

[Inruin]

I'm old enough to remember when charter schools started to be given public monies. Prior to that they were predominitely church- based.
The average kiwi was outraged that such exclusive, privately-owned and supported schools (through rich and priviledged sectors like farmers - even though they were the most govt subsidised industries around) could partake of the limited public purse. Guess which de ile schools had to grin and bear reduced funding?

And predominantly the ones that wanted to see them go were Labour and the teachers union. That tells you all you really need to know in my opinion. Wiz has touched on funding in the previous post.

One other thing I'll add, in my opinion, one of the biggest hurdles to improving education outcomes is the teachers union.

 

[Juno]

How much funding do they get?

All private schools get funding at the same rate as state schools. Is it more or less than that?

All schools in addition to operational funding get capital investment as well on a need basis. If it’s more than the operational of normal schools, was it for capital investment?

Personally just like health care or super, all children should get the same investment from the government - even home schooled kids get funding.

Don't forget that churches in nz are most often charitable trusts & don't pay taxes like businesses, even today. Education has always been and must still be today, be a good way of 'minimising' any profit...
chartered schools AND also havng a now legitimised hand in the public schools pot...win,win

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Don't forget that churches in nz are most often charitable trusts & don't pay taxes like businesses, even today. Education has always been and must still be today, be a good way of 'minimising' any profit...
chartered schools AND also havng a now legitimised hand in the public schools pot...win,win

Fair point about tax free income!

 

[tyrael]

I'm pretty sure private schools get 0 dollars from the government.

Religious integrated schools do get monies.

Using the oh these kids are below average and 85% is out of reach is a bad argument because

1) most kids who are going to these schools year after year will be in similar situations
2) charter schools get many folds more money than public schools which is extra funding to help with those needs, exactly what public schools have been asking for forever

 

[tyrael]

It's

And predominantly the ones that wanted to see them go were Labour and the teachers union. That tells you all you really need to know in my opinion. Wiz has touched on funding in the previous post.

One other thing I'll add, in my opinion, one of the biggest hurdles to improving education outcomes is the teachers union.

It's actually not the unions is actually about quality of student applicants and quality of university education for wannabe teachers.

Both are extremely poor.

It's like some Cops in America who only get 6 weeks of training and don't get psychologically tested to see if they have an anger issue.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

I'm pretty sure private schools get 0 dollars from the government.

Definitely do get govt funding:

https://www.education.govt.nz/schoo...hool Subsidy Funding,New Zealand for the year.

 

[Juno]

I'm pretty sure private schools get 0 dollars from the government.

Religious integrated schools do get monies.

Using the oh these kids are below average and 85% is out of reach is a bad argument because

1) most kids who are going to these schools year after year will be in similar situations
2) charter schools get many folds more money than public schools which is extra funding to help with those needs, exactly what public schools have been asking for forever

Lets see what happens eh? Luxon is a self-confessed godbotherer as a member/ follower of some slightly obscure church.

 

[Inruin]

It's

It's actually not the unions is actually about quality of student applicants and quality of university education for wannabe teachers.

Both are extremely poor.

It's like some Cops in America who only get 6 weeks of training and don't get psychologically tested to see if they have an anger issue.

I didn't say they were the only thing! You are right about the quality of teachers coming through training college. And there are various reasons for that.

@wizard of Tauranga what is your experience with qualified ECE teachers? I can't quite recall, but didn't the government of the time set funding for 100% qualified teachers, then realise there weren't enough for that to be achievable as well as ignoring the very good people working who didn't have the qualifications, which led to lower quality of people pushed through with a qualification and overall a lower standard of education?

 

[tyrael]

There are parts of charter schools that I like but they should work on getting them integrated to public schools.

If a qualified doctor wants to teach, don't make them study for a year before they can teach. (and give up a years salary)

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

I didn't say they were the only thing! You are right about the quality of teachers coming through training college. And there are various reasons for that.

@wizard of Tauranga what is your experience with qualified ECE teachers? I can't quite recall, but didn't the government if the time set funding for 100% qualified teachers, then realise there weren't enough for that to be achievable as well as ignoring the very good people working who didn't have the qualifications?

100% has always been a long term goal but there has never been enough teachers. Chronic shortages without 100%.

In ECE, as in many industries, experience is as important as qualifications. Teaching is like a trade - 90% of day to day is repetitive and you learn by experience and 10% technical stuff where a degree adds value. You need the qualified teachers that understand how children learn to lead the programme but unqualified are more than capable of working under the qualified teacher.

ECE is a little different in that you work in teams rather than individually - a group of teachers in a room rather than one. It arguably works better with a mix or qualified and unqualified so there is a clear hierarchy rather than a clash of teaching philosophies.

 

[sup42]

The māori model for environmental management would fix the water quality issues in NZ by placing the health of Rivers and oceans above all other wasted sources of spending on stupid shit like sports arts etc etc.

Racism...holding NZ back since eighteen forty.

 

[Worried2Death]

The māori model for environmental management would fix the water quality issues in NZ by placing the health of Rivers and oceans above all other wasted sources of spending on stupid shit like sports arts etc etc.

Racism...holding NZ back since eighteen forty.

Seems like a good place to start, common sense that we're all fuçked when the water's toxic.

 

[Juno]

How much funding do they get?

All private schools get funding at the same rate as state schools. Is it more or less than that?

All schools in addition to operational funding get capital investment as well on a need basis. If it’s more than the operational of normal schools, was it for capital investment?
I agree that all kids should
Personally just like health care or super, all children should get the same investment from the government - even home schooled kids get funding.

How much funding do they get?

All private schools get funding at the same rate as state schools. Is it more or less than that?

All schools in addition to operational funding get capital investment as well on a need basis. If it’s more than the operational of normal schools, was it for capital investment?

Personally just like health care or super, all children should get the same investment from the government - even home schooled kids get funding.

I agree kids education should be invested in (equally & equitably).
Do you think private school teachers are paid the same as public school teachers?
Do you think charter school teachers are selected by competency or in line with the charter school objectives?
Do you think Decile 1 schools get the pick of the rest or do Decile 10 schools get to pick first?
Just curious...

 

[Noitall]

Stuff

www.newshub.co.nz

Aussie’s up in arms after Gus is killed, could send relations to an all time low.

 

[John Nick]

Stuff

www.newshub.co.nz

Aussie’s up in arms after Gus is killed, could send relations to an all time low.

Another 501 packing his bags??

 

[dean]

Stuff

www.newshub.co.nz

Aussie’s up in arms after Gus is killed, could send relations to an all time low.

Dog act. Fine him the full $22k.

 

[Noitall]

Dog act. Fine him the full $22k.

Can recall working over in Niue and out on the piss, one of the builders drove us back in a van and run over an unga crab. They were fuming.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Is the age of liberalism coming to an end?

The collapse of neoliberalism, the rise of fascism, and building the left.

www.jphilll.com

New year, same old me banging on about the perils of neoliberalism (or at least echoing my chamber)