Current Affairs 🌡️ Weather / climate change

[Tragic]

So looking at it analytically with the facts from the article:

- Climate change ‘increased the amount of total rainfall during Cyclone Gabrielle by 10%
- It claimed the lives of 11 people and causing damage estimated at $13.5 billion.

1 - 11 lives is insignificant in the scheme of things with White Island, Christchurch earthquakes, covid, etc killing much more. A weekend road toll kills more.
2 - $13.5b every 25 years we have a major Cyclone is relatively insignificant and pales compared to the major earthquakes we get every 10 years or so.
3 - the cyclone only made the storm 10% worse so realistically climate change actually cost maybe 1 extra life and $1.3b extra damage.
4 - climate change will also bring benefits as well - crops able to grow in new places, more settled weather between the extreme events, etc. example the flip side of increased deaths from heat waves may be decreased deaths from cold spells.

In the scheme of things climate change will cause us challenges but there are worse things to fear - major pandemics; tsunamis, major earthquakes, etc.

Ignoring the stuff you just made up, your argument could have some merit if we are carbon neutral from now. That seems unlikely don't you think?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Ignoring the stuff you just made up, your argument could have some merit if we are carbon neutral from now. That seems unlikely don't you think?

I’ve said for many years we have a worldwide over population problem.

The draw on resources and impact on the environment is the symptom not the problem.

 

[Worried2Death]

I’ve said for many years we have a worldwide over population problem.

The draw on resources and impact on the environment is the symptom not the problem.

What do you propose we do about that Dr Evil?

 

[Bay39er]

I look forward to your well thought out rebuttal

Should climate change get extra prioritisation over earthquake preparation or pandemic responses which I feel will impact NZ a lot more in the future and has in the past?

To be frank Wiz I wouldn’t waste my time as you can find all the scientific information yourself.

 

[Tragic]

I’ve said for many years we have a worldwide over population problem.

The draw on resources and impact on the environment is the symptom not the problem.

So are you saying you welcome climate change as it solves an over population issue?
Ignoring the obvious ethical issue and the fact that you can't choose who is impacted so it might be you and your family, how are you going to turn it off once you think enough people have died?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

To be frank Wiz I wouldn’t waste my time as you can find all the scientific information yourself.

We’re not discussing the science as we all agree climate change is going to impact us.

It’s the grey area of how we respond, what we prioritise, how we prepare, etc

 

[Inruin]

So are you saying you welcome climate change as it solves an over population issue?
Ignoring the obvious ethical issue and the fact that you can't choose who is impacted so it might be you and your family, how are you going to turn it off once you think enough people have died?

I think if we are genuinely serious about climate change there has to be the very difficult discussion around population control by everyone. No, not killing off people but limiting reproduction. What population is optimal to maintain balance? How many of the population at the moment are actually a drain on the planet?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

So are you saying you welcome climate change as it solves an over population issue?
Ignoring the obvious ethical issue and the fact that you can't choose who is impacted so it might be you and your family, how are you going to turn it off once you think enough people have died?

Think you took that the wrong way!

It’s the ‘extra’ few billion we have that’s causing the issues. With our current population we need to over exploit resources and put a strain on the environment to support the population.

I’m not saying climate change is the solution by killing people, I’m saying it’s the result of to many people.

I take the position we adapt and manage it and get our population under control, not kill off people.

Ultimately the population needs to live sustainably within what the land and environment can handle.

 

[Tragic]

Think you took that the wrong way!

It’s the ‘extra’ few billion we have that’s causing the issues. With our current population we need to over exploit resources and put a strain on the environment to support the population.

I’m not saying climate change is the solution by killing people, I’m saying it’s the result of to many people.

I take the position we adapt and manage it and get our population under control, not kill off people.

Ultimately the population needs to live sustainably.

Isn't Elon going to solve that by sending them to Mars?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Isn't Elon going to solve that by sending them to Mars?

As long as we don’t over populate there as well

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

What do you propose we do about that Dr Evil?

At what point is feeding the starving kids in Africa actually enabling poverty, overpopulation, excessive resource depletion and excess climate damage?

Free condoms and birth control for the third world will do more than taxing a farting cow.

 

[tyrael]

Earth Temperature Timeline

xkcd.com

 

[MrFrankWhite]

More of this and worse - https://niwa.co.nz/news/cyclone-gabrielle-was-intensified-human-induced-global-warming

Except the physicist I posted above says claims like these are bullshit.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

More of this and worse - https://niwa.co.nz/news/cyclone-gabrielle-was-intensified-human-induced-global-warming

Mediocre academics strikes again. Ideologue with an excel spreadsheet. These people aren’t scientists, they are statisticians.

Dáithí Stone
Climate Scientist
My research interests focus around the detection and attribution of climate change and of its effects on human and natural systems. Essentially this means trying to figure out whether and by how much human activities are causing various aspects of the climate system to change

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Think you took that the wrong way!

It’s the ‘extra’ few billion we have that’s causing the issues. With our current population we need to over exploit resources and put a strain on the environment to support the population.

I’m not saying climate change is the solution by killing people, I’m saying it’s the result of to many people.

I take the position we adapt and manage it and get our population under control, not kill off people.

Ultimately the population needs to live sustainably within what the land and environment can handle.

Rubbish. The overpopulation argument is completely fantasy by discredited greenies. We have more than enough space and more than enough resources

 

[Worried2Death]

At what point is feeding the starving kids in Africa actually enabling poverty, overpopulation, excessive resource depletion and excess climate damage?

Free condoms and birth control for the third world will do more than taxing a farting cow.

Developed country birth rates are dropping below replacement so we might need those high birth countries to replace ourselves soon, assuming continuation of our species is the goal.

Biggest polluters and climate damagers, hmm, presently that would be India, China and USA, particularly the US military industrial complex. Hey Wiz, can you call Elon and tell him to depop those three countries immediately, cheers.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Developed country birth rates are dropping below replacement so we might need those high birth countries to replace ourselves soon, assuming continuation of our species is the goal.

Aren’t those developed countries just stabilising to reach harmony with nature?

Biggest polluters and climate damagers, hmm, presently that would be India, China and USA, particularly the US military industrial complex. Hey Wiz, can you call Elon and tell him to depop those three countries immediately, cheers.

Free birth control for India, China and the US then. India and China are an environmental mess, with their population having a low quality of life.

The rich countries can offshore their environmental damage to 3rd world countries because those countries are overpopulated so work for peanuts.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Rubbish. The overpopulation argument is completely fantasy by discredited greenies. We have more than enough space and more than enough resources

I think the greenies support a bigger population.

‘The overpopulation narrative is an outdated frame that was popularized in the 1960s. It serves to redirect the blame for societal problems to those with the least power to address them’ - Greenpeace

I think we can handle a big population but only as science and technology allows it and I think we’ve overshot our capacity at this point. It’s not just climate change. It’s the smog levels in cities, rate of extinction of animals, land (housing) increasing faster than wage growth, loss of biodiversity, third world poverty, cost of living crises, etc

As I’ve said overall society is improving for the majority and we will adapt to climate change but we will have issues to overcome along the way.

Overpopulation and Environmentalism - Greenpeace - Greenpeace

by Dakota Schee and Varsha Nair You may have heard people say, “we wouldn’t be in a climate crisis if we had fewer people on Earth.” The overpopulation narrative is an…

www.greenpeace.org

 

[MrFrankWhite]

I think we can handle a big population but only as science and technology allows it and I think we’ve overshot our capacity at this point. It’s not just climate change. It’s the smog levels in cities, rate of extinction of animals, land (housing) increasing faster than wage growth, loss of biodiversity, third world poverty, cost of living crises, etc

Weve solved a lot of these. Beijing probably has cleaner air than Auckland.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Weve solved a lot of these. Beijing probably has cleaner air than Auckland.

Not quite: