Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[snake77]

3 Waters would not have been a long long time to every seeing any results.

People on here criticise the current government or politicians in general for not being honest. Well the most transparent government ever was lying to the country about 3 Waters.

When it was just being proposed. Money was being spent on it. When they couldn't answer basic questions on how it would work they said it was on hold and they will sort those points out. Money was still being spent on it. Likely after stuffing up KiwiBuild so much they were trying to get ahead.

Reading the above and seeing money being spent on water infrastructure might make you think that is great as that was the entire point. Replace the water infrastructure. It wasn't the infrastructure everyone was talking about when 3Waters and the water infrastructure was discussed.

Consolidating the different councils into a larger organisation is the project that should have happened. Consolidate things and standardise the systems running the infrastructure. Instead councils got money and the change was like moving the same systems but locating them 20 metres to the left.

 

[Rick O’Shay]

3 Waters would not have been a long long time to every seeing any results.

People on here criticise the current government or politicians in general for not being honest. Well the most transparent government ever was lying to the country about 3 Waters.

When it was just being proposed. Money was being spent on it. When they couldn't answer basic questions on how it would work they said it was on hold and they will sort those points out. Money was still being spent on it. Likely after stuffing up KiwiBuild so much they were trying to get ahead.

Reading the above and seeing money being spent on water infrastructure might make you think that is great as that was the entire point. Replace the water infrastructure. It wasn't the infrastructure everyone was talking about when 3Waters and the water infrastructure was discussed.

Consolidating the different councils into a larger organisation is the project that should have happened. Consolidate things and standardise the systems running the infrastructure. Instead councils got money and the change was like moving the same systems but locating them 20 metres to the left.

It was a thinly veiled attempt by Nanaia and a few other grifters to introduce a system whereby the ticket could be clipped for every litre used.
The consolidation and debt issues were solvable. The Mana O Te Wai implementation wasn't. When the PM could see the game was up with the public it was in the process of being remodeled/shelved then during a late night sitting Nanaia, behind everyone's back (apparently) cooked up a deal with the Greens to raise the repeal numbers and make it very difficult to get rid of the legislation (which had been passed under urgency)

Disgraceful period of politics/law making in this country and reflected badly on the Labour party and Maoridom in general.

 

[MaybeTop8]

It was a thinly veiled attempt by Nanaia and a few other grifters to introduce a system whereby the ticket could be clipped for every litre used.
The consolidation and debt issues were solvable. The Mana O Te Wai implementation wasn't. When the PM could see the game was up with the public it was in the process of being remodeled/shelved then during a late night sitting Nanaia, behind everyone's back (apparently) cooked up a deal with the Greens to raise the repeal numbers and make it very difficult to get rid of the legislation (which had been passed under urgency)

Disgraceful period of politics/law making in this country and reflected badly on the Labour party and Maoridom in general.

A right wing viewpoint clearly from you Rick.

Honouring our fresh water: What is Te Mana o te Wai? - Greenpeace Aotearoa

Te Mana o te Wai is a world-leading policy framework that ensures the health of water is protected. But the government wants to ditch this protection.

www.greenpeace.org

Chris Finlayson: Co-governance should be embraced — not feared | E-Tangata

“A decade of my life was spent on Treaty settlements. I think many people would be a lot more sympathetic toward the notion of co-governance if they learned the things that I was able to learn as a public official in that role.” — Chris Finlayson, former Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations.

e-tangata.co.nz

 

[MrFrankWhite]

It was a thinly veiled attempt by Nanaia and a few other grifters to introduce a system whereby the ticket could be clipped for every litre used.
The consolidation and debt issues were solvable. The Mana O Te Wai implementation wasn't. When the PM could see the game was up with the public it was in the process of being remodeled/shelved then during a late night sitting Nanaia, behind everyone's back (apparently) cooked up a deal with the Greens to raise the repeal numbers and make it very difficult to get rid of the legislation (which had been passed under urgency)

Disgraceful period of politics/law making in this country and reflected badly on the Labour party and Maoridom in general.

Guardianship didn't work out too well for the Moa..

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Make the gallows great again..

Child sex exploitation, bestiality material allegedly found on work devices of ex-top cop

Media can now report nature of material that led to resignation of deputy police chief.

www.nzherald.co.nz

 

[Rick O’Shay]

A right wing viewpoint clearly from you Rick.

View attachment 13816

Honouring our fresh water: What is Te Mana o te Wai? - Greenpeace Aotearoa

Te Mana o te Wai is a world-leading policy framework that ensures the health of water is protected. But the government wants to ditch this protection.

www.greenpeace.org

Chris Finlayson: Co-governance should be embraced — not feared | E-Tangata

“A decade of my life was spent on Treaty settlements. I think many people would be a lot more sympathetic toward the notion of co-governance if they learned the things that I was able to learn as a public official in that role.” — Chris Finlayson, former Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations.

e-tangata.co.nz

Do some decent reading. The original concept was okay with consolidation but there was never enough thought put into the financing nor the bringing onboard of the iwi and how that would affect the decision making.

Nothing right wing about it, just a pack of grifters sniffing out a new way to fleece the public. Nothing in what you posted explains who has the power over the decision making on water and more importantly, who has the veto. As I said, go and actually read the bill before posting that crap

Cabinet loses grip of Five Waters

The speed at which the government is attempting to ram through the Water Services Entities Bill into law is exposing Cabinet's lack of grip on the details of these reforms.

cranmer.substack.com

 

[MaybeTop8]

Do some decent reading. The original concept was okay with consolidation but there was never enough thought put into the financing nor the bringing onboard of the iwi and how that would affect the decision making.

Nothing right wing about it, just a pack of grifters sniffing out a new way to fleece the public. Nothing in what you posted explains who has the power over the decision making on water and more importantly, who has the veto. As I said, go and actually read the bill before posting that crap

Cabinet loses grip of Five Waters

The speed at which the government is attempting to ram through the Water Services Entities Bill into law is exposing Cabinet's lack of grip on the details of these reforms.

cranmer.substack.com

 

[Rick O’Shay]

Do some digging and stop flogging sites that support the grift.
The facts on the 3 waters fiasco are clear and simple. One or two thought they could make a buck, got found out, tried to slip in some dodgy legislation and headed for the bush.

Follow the money, in fact I wouldn't be surprised if Big Nan was on the Atlas payroll, the deal was very neo liberal thinking about how to make the most out of natural resources.
I'm still hunting to see if Johnny B Tee was involved. Think he was but still looking what the TPM involvement was. TBA

 

[miket12]

For those who consider that the government “compensation” when 3 Waters was taking over the local water assets was “fair and reasonable, consider this….. in 2024, WaterCare’s assets were valued at just under $16.4 billion (page 21 of their annual report below) but the government only budgeted $1.7 billion (according to the Herald report linked below) as compensation ALL to the councils leaving the councils a huge amount of money they had borrowed on assets they no longer owned and no longer received income (Water rates) for.

And before you think it’s still okay for the government to not pay the full cost for the council’s providing their assets, WaterCare, from their annual report, built over $1 billion of new infrastructure just in the 2023-24 financial period. Government’s compensation for the assets they took over would barely have covered the cost of all the councils water infrastructure spending within one year…… let alone the decades of locally built infrastructure.

Sorry, but 3Waters was a way to move publicly owned local assets to a central government organisation while not paying the councils the cost of establishing the infrastructure in the first place while still leaving the debt with the rate payers.

https://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/plans-projects-policies-reports-bylaws/our-annual-reports/docsccosannualreports/watercare-annual-report-2024.pdf

WDC one of three councils challenging the Three Waters restructure

Councils seeking determination around property ownership rights and interests.

www.nzherald.co.nz

 

[MaybeTop8]

Do some digging and stop flogging sites that support the grift.
The facts on the 3 waters fiasco are clear and simple. One or two thought they could make a buck, got found out, tried to slip in some dodgy legislation and headed for the bush.

Follow the money, in fact I wouldn't be surprised if Big Nan was on the Atlas payroll, the deal was very neo liberal thinking about how to make the most out of natural resources.
I'm still hunting to see if Johnny B Tee was involved. Think he was but still looking what the TPM involvement was. TBA

Support the grift - you're sounding like a conspiracy theorist Rick. A Trump supporter.

That's been a factor in how the right and far right have played all of this in the long game - use the language of those who oppose against them.

There's an underlying sense of resentment I'm hearing - interesting that you're raising the spectre of Atlas and neoliberalism when I hear nothing from you on ACT or National.

Careful Rick - your bias is showing.

 

[MaybeTop8]

'Seymour's letter is about avoiding accountability' | E-Tangata

David Seymour “referred to himself as an ‘Indigenous New Zealander’ . . . He was employing a tactic we’ve seen domestically many times: invoking his ancestry to deflect criticism of his racist behaviour.” — Tina Ngata.

e-tangata.co.nz

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Support the grift - you're sounding like a conspiracy theorist Rick. A Trump supporter.

That's been a factor in how the right and far right have played all of this in the long game - use the language of those who oppose against them.

There's an underlying sense of resentment I'm hearing - interesting that you're raising the spectre of Atlas and neoliberalism when I hear nothing from you on ACT or National.

Careful Rick - your bias is showing.

Well, can you explain the Mahuta 60% fiasco?

Low point in Labours term and 3 waters highlighted everything wrong with Labours last term.

It was a problem that could have had a simple solution around higher regulations but it grew to a convoluted, impractical outcome that even Hipkins admitted they cocked up big time.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Well, can you explain the Mahuta 60% fiasco?

Low point in Labours term and 3 waters highlighted everything wrong with Labours last term.

It was a problem that could have had a simple solution around higher regulations but it grew to a convoluted, impractical outcome that even Hipkins admitted they cocked up big time.

Links?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Links?

To what?

Hipkins: ‘controversial reforms has become “confused” and the focus needs to be on “affordable water infrastructure”.

Now you explain the 60% Mahuta fiasco in your own words…

And show us the money - where did the $500m on 3 waters go? What pipes are now better???

'Three Waters' to become 'Affordable Water Infrastructure'?

PM Chris Hipkins signals Three Waters rebrand, to be announced 'imminently'.

www.nzherald.co.nz

 

[Rick O’Shay]

Links?

Read the article I posted by Phillip Crump and check his previous blogs regarding the issues with Scottish and Thames water.
The stuff you posted does not go into the decision making process that was being proposed through the Te Mana O Te Wai statements. That's the rub. No non elected body should ever control a natural resource.

Oh and by the way, Findlayson is the biggest grifter of them all, he makes Tamihere look like a kindergarten pupil

 

[Rick O’Shay]

Support the grift - you're sounding like a conspiracy theorist Rick. A Trump supporter.

That's been a factor in how the right and far right have played all of this in the long game - use the language of those who oppose against them.

There's an underlying sense of resentment I'm hearing - interesting that you're raising the spectre of Atlas and neoliberalism when I hear nothing from you on ACT or National.

Careful Rick - your bias is showing.

My bias is against anyone who takes advantage of others through nefarious processes or dealings, which is exactly what happened with 3/5 Waters and why it got the arse.

Not too sure what I'm resentful of, my water tanks are full and the pump works when I tell it to turn on

And I think Act and National are more Labour lite than anything else.

Luxon is the 3rd worst PM we've had since 2017