Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[John Nick]

Mate, when your really successful you find you can buy more free time

You will notice I go in fits and bursts - sometimes I’m working 7 days a week, other times I’ve got plenty of time to be on here!

Ironically I’m about to start work an 4pm today and will be working late tonight.

I'm only taking the piss.
I am in much the same situation.
I was up early and finished my work early

 

[miket12]

@John Nick, have you heard anything about Wayne Brown’s proposal to sell off the operational arm of POAL?

 

[juju]

I was just in the local dairy and having a chat to the owner. Apparently it's still illegal for 14 year olds to buy smokes.

For someone so pent up about vape use, should we all be worried it sounds like you have no grasp of the policy at hand.

Maybe you should ask the diary owner if he a member of "save our stores" A lobby group funded by British American Tabacco.

 

[Worried2Death]

Hitlercinda? There goes any credibility you might have had. It's beneath you.

"It was all satire, I was just pretending to be retarded"

 

[John Nick]

@John Nick, have you heard anything about Wayne Brown’s proposal to sell off the operational arm of POAL?

Yes

 

[Inruin]

For someone so pent up about vape use, should we all be worried it sounds like you have no grasp of the policy at hand.

Maybe you should ask the diary owner if he a member of "save our stores" A lobby group funded by British American Tabacco.

So there wasn't anything about people born after 31st December 2008 being banned from purchasing tobacco?

#threadBackOnTrack

 

[juju]

So there wasn't anything about people born after 31st December 2008 being banned from purchasing tobacco?

#threadBackOnTrack

Way to completely miss the whole concept of the legislation.

 

[John Nick]

Way to completely miss the whole concept of the legislation.

Political career in waiting

 

[Inruin]

Way to completely miss the whole concept of the legislation.

No I got it. Just don't think a smokefree generation that doesn't start for another 3 or 4 years is making any difference until then, and even then it would be minimal. So talk that more people will take up smoking because that has been scrapped is ridiculous. As for the reduction in stores which wouldn't start until July next year, creates more issues as well. People are giving up smoking year on year and that's going to continue because of the measures in place. Unfortunately they are switching to vaping. Many, many more people took up vaping last year than those who quit smoking. And yet vapes are available everywhere. Like I have said before, they are just moving to a different issue. So, I'm glad the coalition is focusing on the current issues.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

This is a really good thread by someone who has spent the time to read the two coaltion agreements and extract the key policies - well worth a read;

That’s a hodgepodge of dopey fucking ideas designed to enrich a select number of people.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

I support public transport but it has to be appropriate to the size of the city, how and where people want to go and not a giant white elephant that stops all future public transport project because it bankrupts us.

Bullshit. That’s what NZ has always done. Built infrastructure for what’s required at the time. And after inevitable delays and recostings, it’s insufficient for use.

Auckland is a fucking 3rd world country and in 20 years, you still have a potholed single lane road from the airport.

The councils have been anti-car, so like with co-governance there will is a big backlash and bad will which will do more harm than good for the cause. You gotta take the people with you.

Working middle class kiwis before the vocal Lycra brigade

Councils are useless institutions that take the path of least resistance. And that’s usually some bullshit study by some numpty whose “modelled” the results.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

I’m actually pro the city loop and half my post was in dismay and jest about the cost and time taken.

The issue and NZ’s big issue is our productivity is killing us. We’re so slow and inefficient at building infrastructure, we end up build half the amount of anyone else at twice the cost. That’s a huge drag on us as a country stopping us getting good stuff everyone else takes for granted. Crippling financially and in lost opportunity.

The loop is going to take 10 years to build, announced in 2013, fully funded in 2015 and still at least a year from being finished… before 6 months commissioning, etc

The $2.86b cost has almost doubled to $5.4b with more cost over runs to come.

I drive through our local Bayfair roadworks which is a couple of Bridges and a roundabout and it’s been going on since 2015 and isn’t finished yet and is double budget. The joke about NZ having more road cones than sheep isn’t so funny when it’s you realise it’s true

That’s western democracies. You want to give every peasant a say, be prepared to be mired in bureaucracy.

Plus times and costs don’t “blow out” they a lot of the time horrifically under quoted, given to a crony corrupt company, who then starts releasing the real costs.

 

[John Nick]

No I got it. Just don't think a smokefree generation that doesn't start for another 3 or 4 years is making any difference until then, and even then it would be minimal. So talk that more people will take up smoking because that has been scrapped is ridiculous. As for the reduction in stores which wouldn't start until July next year, creates more issues as well. People are giving up smoking year on year and that's going to continue because of the measures in place. Unfortunately they are switching to vaping. Many, many more people took up vaping last year than those who quit smoking. And yet vapes are available everywhere. Like I have said before, they are just moving to a different issue. So, I'm glad the coalition is focusing on the current issues.

Vaping has only become an issue in the past 7/8 years to my knowledge

 

[John Nick]

Bullshit. That’s what NZ has always done. Built infrastructure for what’s required at the time. And after inevitable delays and recostings, it’s insufficient for use.

Auckland is a fucking 3rd world country and in 20 years, you still have a potholed single lane road from the airport.


Councils are useless institutions that take the path of least resistance. And that’s usually some bullshit study by some numpty whose “modelled” the results.

Couldn't agree more. This is the type of thinking that we are suffering from right now.
If only Dove Meyer Robinson had been listened to we would not have this debacle we have now

 

[MrFrankWhite]

I don’t have a problem with that option

However, it is my view that the govt has a spending problem. It should be able to deliver essentials with less money by cutting wasteful projects and operating with more discipline

Of course governments have spending problems. Dopey citizens keep demanding more and more with zero accountability.

Let’s take public transport vs roading. Previous comment alluded wasted billions on PT. But zero mention of the billions and billions that gets handed to your roading mafia to do the worst job in the developed world. Nigeria has better roads than Auckland.

No other companies get billions to do a substandard job and then billions more to try and fix it.

But because that spending is hidden in commercial revenue it’s deemed “good”.
And to that low wage earners becoming slum landlords and it’s no wonder that NZ is a joke.

Funny thing is NZ is the Spider-Man meme, each side of politics pointing at the other. Facts is both parties share blame for the last 40years of NZ politics.

 

[snake77]

Of course governments have spending problems. Dopey citizens keep demanding more and more with zero accountability.

Let’s take public transport vs roading. Previous comment alluded wasted billions on PT. But zero mention of the billions and billions that gets handed to your roading mafia to do the worst job in the developed world. Nigeria has better roads than Auckland.

No other companies get billions to do a substandard job and then billions more to try and fix it.

But because that spending is hidden in commercial revenue it’s deemed “good”.
And to that low wage earners becoming slum landlords and it’s no wonder that NZ is a joke.

Funny thing is NZ is the Spider-Man meme, each side of politics pointing at the other. Facts is both parties share blame for the last 40years of NZ politics.

We have a new expressway between Auckland and Hamilton. If anyone can do a trip in both directions without hitting any road works, especially on the new piece that is less than 5 years old without hitting road works. They should buy a lotto ticket as chances are it's your lucky day.

I have to drive through there often. Either to get to family, to Hamilton to meet family halfway, or for work. When it opened you got a drive that wasn't disrupted. The last few years there is usually a few sections where it is down to one lane for repairs which creates a queue. Or you get redirected to the other side of the road which then impacts that direction as it's down to one lane.

I've stopped on that expressway quite often and admired how much road seal they are putting down.

 

[juju]

No I got it. Just don't think a smokefree generation that doesn't start for another 3 or 4 years is making any difference until then, and even then it would be minimal. So talk that more people will take up smoking because that has been scrapped is ridiculous. As for the reduction in stores which wouldn't start until July next year, creates more issues as well. People are giving up smoking year on year and that's going to continue because of the measures in place. Unfortunately they are switching to vaping. Many, many more people took up vaping last year than those who quit smoking. And yet vapes are available everywhere. Like I have said before, they are just moving to a different issue. So, I'm glad the coalition is focusing on the current issues.

No you don't get it at all if you don't understand the social investment angle of the policy which was spelled out clearly by treasure and health professionals.

What's ridiculous you think you know better than the qualified health and addiction practitioners that have praised its (and now lamented its demise) as world leading and the countries who used it as frame work for similar.

What's also ridiculous is you've only mentioned this legislation after NZF have had it removed.

What's also ridiculous is you've failed to acknowledge the role the tobacco industry has played by spending money lobbying behind the scenes.

What's also ridiculous is a finance minister needing this revenue to fund promised tax cuts they failed to negotiate properly in a coalition agreement.

 

[Bay39er]

What is also ridiculous is the PM trying to justify it on the basis that it’s not fair that a 36 year old can smoke but a 35 year old can’t.

Is that the same lack of fairness where a 15 year old can get a licence but a 14 year old can’t?

 

[Inruin]

No you don't get it at all if you don't understand the social investment angle of the policy which was spelled out clearly by treasure and health professionals.

What's ridiculous you think you know better than the qualified health and addiction practitioners that have praised its (and now lamented its demise) as world leading and the countries who used it as frame work for similar.

What's also ridiculous is you've only mentioned this legislation after NZF have had it removed.

What's also ridiculous is you've failed to acknowledge the role the tobacco industry has played by spending money lobbying behind the scenes.

What's also ridiculous is a finance minister needing this revenue to fund promised tax cuts they failed to negotiate properly in a coalition agreement.

So now you trust Nicola's numbers!

The first part of the repealed legislation which is the people born after 2008 has zero impact for at least 3 years. In that time more people will have stopped smoking and many more than that number will have started vaping. No people are going to start smoking in the next 3 years because the age limit has been left at 18+ and I doubt any will after that because vaping has taken over.

Yup, you can argue that the limiting of stores will reduce the availability of tobacco but also creates other issues which have been highlighted already in previous posts.

I'm more worried about the current levels of vaping which is only increasing and increasing by far more than are quitting smoking. How many people are now vaping in NZ? This is by far the biggest issue IMO. Apparently you don't and Labour didn't either until too late and they needed to look like they were doing something about it to get votes. Great that the coalition is putting social investment in to that.

 

[Inruin]

What is also ridiculous is the PM trying to justify it on the basis that it’s not fair that a 36 year old can smoke but a 35 year old can’t.

Is that the same lack of fairness where a 15 year old can get a licence but a 14 year old can’t?

Are you comparing getting your driver's license at an age where society and lawmakers have deemed them mature enough to take on the responsibility of that and compliance is easily controlled and enforced, to a 35 being incapable of making the informed decision whether to smoke or not but a 36 year old can?