Social ⚔️ Palestine, Israel war.

[regenerated borg]

Thing is, there was a cease fire for 17 years until Hamas broke it on Oct 7 ..
Hamas is losing now and Hezbollah and others haven't jumped in as probably expected (US carrier group deterent)
Israel want the hostages back but I wouldn't be surprised if most of them are dead now. If so then why offer only a few?
This war has backfired for Hamas, exposed the brutal attack to start with then using human shields all falls on them...
By the way when reporters go live on TV in Gaza what you don't see are the Hamas gunman off camera making sure those reporters don't favour Israel in any way..

 

[Rizzah]

Thing is, there was a cease fire for 17 years until Hamas broke it on Oct 7 ..
Hamas is losing now and Hezbollah and others haven't jumped in as probably expected (US carrier group deterent)
Israel want the hostages back but I wouldn't be surprised if most of them are dead now. If so then why offer only a few?
This war has backfired for Hamas, exposed the brutal attack to start with then using human shields all falls on them...
By the way when reporters go live on TV in Gaza what you don't see are the Hamas gunman off camera making sure those reporters don't favour Israel in any way..

Lol, Gaza has been under blockade for 17 years. A cease fire??? They are caged in. Israel controls what goes in an out of Gaza. You haven't got a clue.
There has been constant ongoing settler violence in the West Bank for decades. With 500,000 Jewish settlers now occupying property in the West Bank.
The Palestinians are under occupation and apartheid like conditions.

A cease fire you say?
Palestinian casualties this year, prior to Oct 7.
Total: 237
45 Children.
6 Women.

United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs - occupied Palestinian territory | Data on casualties

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www.ochaopt.org

2023 marks deadliest year on record for children in the occupied West Bank - occupied Palestinian territory

News and Press Release in English on occupied Palestinian territory about Protection and Human Rights; published on 18 Sep 2023 by Save the Children

reliefweb.int

Israel's Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession

Mass human rights violations during the 50-year occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip have devastated the lives of millions of Palestinians.

www.amnesty.org

 

[regenerated borg]

Lol, Gaza has been under blockade for 17 years. A cease fire??? They are caged in. Israel controls what goes in an out of Gaza.
You haven't got a clue.

Have you been there, I have ... Gaza is a nice place, so are the people, welcoming to foreigners and like to fleece them for tourist dollars... but not so much Jews...as for blockades it just normal border controls... around 30 to 40k Palestians cross the border each day to go to work in Israel and they can freely wander around as they please ... this wars stopped all that now ... who's to blame for that..
It's their extremist idealist leaders that cause all the trouble ... I just feel sad for the people on both sides of the border none of them deserve this...

 

[Rizzah]

Have you been there, I have ... Gaza is a nice place, so are the people, welcoming to foreigners and like to fleece them for tourist dollars... but not so much Jews...as for blockades it just normal border controls... around 30 to 40k Palestians cross the border each day to go to work in Israel and they can freely wander around as they please ... this wars stopped all that now ... who's to blame for that..
It's their extremist idealist leaders that cause all the trouble ... I just feel sad for the people on both sides of the border none of them deserve this...

Lol, a blockade is normal border controls? It's occupation. A blockade is an act of war. Again, no clue.
Under occupation, at which point are the Palestinians allowed to defend themselves?

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

An interesting take by a political journalist on NewstalkZB today

A left leaner supports Palestine
A right leaner supports Israel

How does that suggestion align with your leanings?

I’m more right wing but I don’t support either side.

Probably more supporting Palestine as the original inhabitants of the land but they started this round through hamus

Israel - I don’t have an answer for. They are out of place there but where do they go? Obviously they just want somewhere to live in peace but it isn’t their land. And they are sort of victims as well having been plonked there by the West in a faulty decision.

Problem I have is there appears no viable solutions, so they are all being driven to extreme action (war crimes) by the current unviable situation.

 

[regenerated borg]

Lol, a blockade is normal border controls? It's occupation. A blockade is an act of war. Again, no clue.
Under occupation, at which point are the Palestinians allowed to defend themselves?

You obviously haven't been there.......

 

[Rizzah]

You obviously haven't been there.......

Lol, what does that have to do with anything? I can read, and have two eyes.
According to you the situation was cozy up until Oct 7 and you know this because you went to Israel once.

 

[Worried2Death]

Hamas want every Jew out of Palestine or dead.
Zionists want all of Palestine.
There's no solution until one side leaves or gets ethnically cleansed.
What's the cure for this religious madness? Highly doubt there is one.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

My heart goes out to the children, All the rest can get stuffed!

A 2 state solution will never work... The rest of the world just don't get it and sometimes poke their noses in where it don't belong.... the Jews have been offering that solution for decades the Palestinians have always said no... do your research. Ever wondered why the Palestinians got booted out of Kuwait Jordan Lebanon and why Arab nations don't want them?
Arafat PlO Hamas all of them never wanted peace in any country.... yesterday, now or tomorrow... Seeing innocent civilians caught up in the middle is awful. I think the obvious answer dare I say it is a 1 state solution something I guess no one really wants to hear...

So if Australia takes NZ and then offers Stewart Island for a “two state solution” kiwis should have to say yes?

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Hamas want every Jew out of Palestine or dead.
Zionists want all of Palestine.
There's no solution until one side leaves or gets ethnically cleansed.
What's the cure for this religious madness? Highly doubt there is one.

They want their land back.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Lol all the backflips on here to ignore the fact that a bunch of terrorists rocked up to an inhabited land, killed 100k, drove 700k from their lands and then proceeded to subjugate their ancestors to military occupation for the next 78 years…

 

[Worried2Death]

They want their land back.

Hard to say who's land it is historically, indigenous semites, Bedouin etc have always been there in small numbers since the Romans cleared it out, Ashkenazem Jews probably have less claim on it than them. Many current Palestinians are descendants of the Arabs who came with the Jews in the first waves of settlement.
What's the solution for religious fanaticism?

The First Aliyah

The First Aliyah, Jewish settlers to the Holy Land from 1881-1901, were secular, idealist and extremely naïve about Arab reaction to their arrival.

www.jewishhistory.org

 

[NZDoug]

Thing is, there was a cease fire for 17 years until Hamas broke it on Oct 7 ..
Hamas is losing now and Hezbollah and others haven't jumped in as probably expected (US carrier group deterent)
Israel want the hostages back but I wouldn't be surprised if most of them are dead now. If so then why offer only a few?
This war has backfired for Hamas, exposed the brutal attack to start with then using human shields all falls on them...
By the way when reporters go live on TV in Gaza what you don't see are the Hamas gunman off camera making sure those reporters don't favour Israel in any way..

A Little Perspective.
Beyond the Two-State Solution?
There has been no real “peace process” between Israelis and Palestinians in the last decade. Israeli politicians prefer to cater to their nationalist base by supporting settlers expanding into Palestinian territory. The Palestinians remain divided, with moderates like Palestinian president Mahmud Abbas marginalized by their inability to deliver political goods, while extremists like Hamas win ‘street cred’ for fighting the Israelis, however futilely.
That makes it perversely easier to resort to war after war rather than accept the risks and political costs of engaging with one’s adversaries.
Perhaps it time to consider alternatives to the two-state solution, which some experts consider to be increasingly unviable due to the expansion of Israeli settlements and the weakness of Palestinian institutions. Other concepts include reinventing Israel as a multi-ethnic state in which Palestinians have citizenship and voting rights, or exploring confederal government.
Such arrangements may seem fantastical given the depth of the animus between Israelis and Palestinians, but that’s because of the prevailing attitude that compromise and coexistence are impossible and not worth trying. That means for now the default strategy is more lawn-mowing—and a future of perpetual war.
E

 

[NZDoug]

my link wont work.
google National Interest and mow rhe lawn and you should get the article.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Hard to say who's land it is historically

No its very easy. Both the Palestinians and the Israelis have quite clear records of what happened in the Nakba. Indigenous Semites are Palestinians and if ancient Bedouins rock up we can deal with it.

Its like the braindead calls to wipe out the treaty becuase of the Mori Ori.

 

[Defence]

Not new but pretty heavy when u hear a kid spitting lyrics like this.

 

[Worried2Death]

No its very easy. Both the Palestinians and the Israelis have quite clear records of what happened in the Nakba. Indigenous Semites are Palestinians and if ancient Bedouins rock up we can deal with it.

Its like the braindead calls to wipe out the treaty becuase of the Mori Ori.

Where should the Jews go, Stewart Island?

 

[Worried2Death]

Other concepts include reinventing Israel as a multi-ethnic state in which Palestinians have citizenship and voting rights, or exploring confederal government.

If only. Lot of moderate secular Jews are all for a solution like this, but how do you reason with Jewish fanatics who believe God promised them the land? Let alone Muslim jihadis determined to kill the Infidels.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

Where should the Jews go, Stewart Island?

They don’t have to go any where

 

[Worried2Death]

They don’t have to go any where

What's your solution Frank, stop expanding the settlements and try to live in harmony together?