NRL NRL Expansion

[Matiunz]

The Christchurch team will likely rely heavily on developing their own players. Which will take time. But when they do……. Goddamn.

Don’t you think with an extra team, more pairs of eyes around NZ that Kiwi talent won’t go to Christchurch as opposed to Australia? They do for rugby. What really the difference. With a bit of time. But at least they have that option. They’ll probably only get Australian journeymen.

What actually has Perth got? It’s a nice city.
(I’ve been there once, genuinely enjoyed it)
But there’s no player base, no player roots, no nothing. A paycheque…… That’s it.

They’ll get journeyman mostly, and pick up an elite talent here and there at an inflated salary. No developed players though, so pretty much all their players will be imported with slightly higher salaries.

Hell with the tax exemptions PNG might even find it easier to recruit. (Probably not elite talent)

100% a second team will help retain more NZers, development can be a tough one as there’s no real guarantee whatever will come through (see Melbournes woeful record).
Have stayed a few times that Perth has a number of pulls particularly around climate and lifestyle (particularly for surfers). Plus the juniors link with Norths.
What has Christchurch got? (In reality not rose tinted glasses) new stadium, some potential (not proven) in juniors. Shit climate, bit of a boring town otherwise

 

[Matiunz]

I wonder if the PNG tax exemption will be a major game changer for them? If you’re 27-28 and looking for the last big contract, all of a sudden a contract from PNG shows up that’s not only paying 100-150k more per year, but you also don’t pay tax on it … that’s another what 50k? All of a sudden a couple years in a gated community worth it to end up 5-600k better off long term?
Not sure it’ll get the marquee talent, but that next tier could find it very appealing.

I honestly don’t know how it’s going to work with png it’s a pretty tough sell. All the money in the world is nice but living in a resort essentially at the cost of freedom can get old pretty quick, talk to Warriors how their years in lockdown effected them.
Locals have potential but again potential doesn’t guarantee results, will take a bit to get them up to speed

 

[Matiunz]

My take is that it’s shaping as NZ vs QLD for the 20th slot, which would suit the NRL to roll out sooner than later if PNG/Perth get up and running.
Think the Wahs, Cows, Titans and Dolphins have showed a blueprint of what does and doesn’t works when it comes to being a successful expansion franchise - so for any bid, can they replicate the good stuff and avoid the bad?
Big investment in juniors and pathways, aligned board and management, quality infrastructure, the marketing savvy to engage and retain a fanbase, the capability to recruit elite operators in coaching, playing and support staff, and operating in an area where you can get a solid fanbase/corporate consistently attending home games (and I’m sure a lot more …)
IF an NZ team could deliver that over a sustained period of time (and fork out the licence fee), I’d think the NRL would push for that over another QLD team - less saturation of the qld market, a team more than happy to play in the early arvo OZ team slot, baked-in rivalry with the Wahs, would likely become every Kiwi league fans fav or second fav team, more development opportunity for Kiwi talent (which is not just good for the Kiwis, but tempting for Oz teams … Perth and PNG will take a lot of players off the board, and Kiwis can’t play Origin).

QLD is the “easy” option but I don’t think it’s the best option just yet.
I’d go NZ 2 first, dolphins need time to embed and we need to move away from the nsw/qld concentration not increase it

 

[Teets]

What has Christchurch got? (In reality not rose tinted glasses) new stadium, some potential (not proven) in juniors. Shit climate, bit of a boring town otherwise

For a lot of Kiwi kids and their families the fact it's not Auckland would be a pretty big selling point.

We've also seen in the crazy registration numbers for Warriors trials there's no shortage of kids willing to play for a NZ NRL pathway these days, the problem is there's only one.

The other code has also shown us a lot of Auckland kids tend to level up down in Christchurch.

 

[Milking!]

100% a second team will help retain more NZers, development can be a tough one as there’s no real guarantee whatever will come through (see Melbournes woeful record).
Have stayed a few times that Perth has a number of pulls particularly around climate and lifestyle (particularly for surfers). Plus the juniors link with Norths.
What has Christchurch got? (In reality not rose tinted glasses) new stadium, some potential (not proven) in juniors. Shit climate, bit of a boring town otherwise

Yeah Chch is a bit of p

I honestly don’t know how it’s going to work with png it’s a pretty tough sell. All the money in the world is nice but living in a resort essentially at the cost of freedom can get old pretty quick, talk to Warriors how their years in lockdown effected them.
Locals have potential but again potential doesn’t guarantee results, will take a bit to get them up to speed

Fair call - if that doesn’t work to recruit players to PNG, though … they could be in for a rough couple of seasons …

 

[WA Warrior]

I honestly don’t know how it’s going to work with png it’s a pretty tough sell. All the money in the world is nice but living in a resort essentially at the cost of freedom can get old pretty quick, talk to Warriors how their years in lockdown effected them.
Locals have potential but again potential doesn’t guarantee results, will take a bit to get them up to speed

Before the Tax Exemptions I thought the PNG team would fail 99%
I’m a little more optimistic now.
That cash could sway a lot of players but I do think the Aussie/NZ players will get sick of living in a compound and all the threats living there for families etc.
I’m optimistic because of the PNG national team and their Schoolboys who had a draw with the Aussie Schoolboys.
If the NRL can tap into that talent pretty quickly I think it could work mainly made up of PNG players.

 

[Milking!]

- Yeah Chch is a bit of punt. They’ll have to rely on developing players - can’t see too many established first graders being lured to the Garden City.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

100% a second team will help retain more NZers, development can be a tough one as there’s no real guarantee whatever will come through (see Melbournes woeful record).
Have stayed a few times that Perth has a number of pulls particularly around climate and lifestyle (particularly for surfers). Plus the juniors link with Norths.
What has Christchurch got? (In reality not rose tinted glasses) new stadium, some potential (not proven) in juniors. Shit climate, bit of a boring town otherwise

At least Christchurch has that option though. Perth has nothing. Like actually nothing.
If Tapine, NAS or Hughes sitting around in Wellington. And Christchurch and Perth come knocking, where you think they’re going to go? Seriously.
Where are those sorts of options for Perth? A 5 hour flight away in North Sydney?

What’s Christchurch got?
The South Island of New Zealand……. One of the adventure capitals in the world. With absolutely beautiful scenery. Christchurch in summer isn’t bad. Winter? Yeah alright I’ll give you that, it’s average. But there’s shit tonnes of stuff to do down there. (You have to remember, these guys have a bit of money atm). You should note loads of NRL players holiday in Queenstown.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

I wonder if the PNG tax exemption will be a major game changer for them? If you’re 27-28 and looking for the last big contract, all of a sudden a contract from PNG shows up that’s not only paying 100-150k more per year, but you also don’t pay tax on it … that’s another what 50k? All of a sudden a couple years in a gated community worth it to end up 5-600k better off long term?
Not sure it’ll get the marquee talent, but that next tier could find it very appealing.

Hahaha this topic was well and truly pumped out a couple months ago.

IMO, money talks. NZs highest tax code is 38%. They’ll probably only be able to attract “good” players. Not elite.

Example: Te Maire Martin (mid level
Half), how much would he be on? No more than 600k.
What if PNG offered him 1 million. With the tax exemption that’s pretty much 1.38 million.
Yeah, I’m pretty sure some “good” players will take something like that.

If I was PNG I wouldn’t even bother with the Cleary’s and Hughes of the world. No chance of getting them. But a really good journeymen? Who knows.

 

[j_p]

Looks like png going to be announced next week.
Ignore the title, not really confirmed yet.

PNG confirmed as new NRL expansion team - but when is still undecided

Papua New Guinea's entry into the NRL is finally set to be announced next week in Sydney - but in a bombshell development, they may not be the next franchise to feature in the competition.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Matiunz]

Looks like png going to be announced next week.
Ignore the title, not really confirmed yet.

PNG confirmed as new NRL expansion team - but when is still undecided

Papua New Guinea's entry into the NRL is finally set to be announced next week in Sydney - but in a bombshell development, they may not be the next franchise to feature in the competition.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The articles comment section is… something else…

 

[WA Warrior]

Sorry I don’t know how to copy and paste off my phone from the Daily Telegraph.
Story on DT of Cameron George and Mark Robinson saying the CHCH team is a mistake.
The timing is not right, they want the NRL to invest in NZ to get the local comp up to QLD comp standard which could take 5-10 years etc etc
CHCH teams must be spewing with the Warriors coming out and openly saying the NRL shouldn’t proceed at this time.

 

[Noitall]

The NRL are at least 10 to 15-years away from being able to expand into New Zealand with a second team to rival the Warriors. That’s the opinion of two of the most powerful men across the Tasman, Warriors owner Mark Robinson and CEO Cameron George, who have declared it would be “devastating” if the NRL added a second franchise anytime soon.

While welcoming the prospect of a second New Zealand team in the future, the influential brains behind the rise of the Warriors have given a warts-and-all account of how much work the NRL have to do to grow the game across the ditch.

George has even had a crack at former NRL and NZRL CEO David Moffett, who is part one of the three New Zealand franchise bids, the South Island Keas.

“What underpins a strong NRL team is having strong elite players that are getting challenged every week in (second-tier) competitions,” George said.

“So when you drop them from NRL down they can find form and come back up.

“Right now, if we drop a player back to a local competition, there’s no chance of being NRL ready a week later.

“It’s funny because David Moffett has been quite vocal about how he’s coming to get the Warriors. “This is the problem. I think he was the CEO of the NRL (in 2001), why didn’t he put money into New Zealand rugby league then?

“Then all of a sudden, we’re saying we’re ready to go now.

“(But) he knows it’s not ready to go.”

George’s comments have emerged ahead of the NRL’s anticipated announcement this week that Papua New Guinea will become the game’s 18th team, potentially by 2028.

Fans and commentators will receive the news by asking questions as to how, given the surge in interest in rugby league in New Zealand, largely due to the Warriors recent success, and the talent pool of schoolboy rugby union players, the NRL haven’t introduced a second team across the Tasman.

George gave a telling insight.

“For us, we’ve never said expansion into New Zealand isn’t right,” George said.

“There’s an opportunity for sure and certain, but it’s the timing of that opportunity.

“To give you an example, the NRL, as I understand it, has people employed working for the NRL, in the Northern Territory. “They have no one working in New Zealand to grow the game.

“We’re (Warriors) the shop front window for the game, along with the Kiwis playing a few times a year.

“My challenge to the NRL and for those that have got bids in is, we’re trying to get more money invested in the game in New Zealand.

“At the moment, we’ve got five teams (NRLW, NSW Cup, Jersey Flegg, SG Ball and Harold Matthews) that sit underneath the NRL.

“For all five of those teams to compete in top line competition they have to travel to Australia.

“You can’t play them locally because the level of competition isn’t there.

“So our message to the NRL is if you’re looking at New Zealand as an expansion opportunity, absolutely it’s an opportunity.

“But it’s going to take at least five to 10-years for the local game to be equal to Queensland Cup or NSW Cup (standard) because there’s no use putting another team here, in Christchurch next week, next year or the year after and flying five teams over (to Australia) because that’s 10 teams going over and back every week.

“It just can’t be sustainable.

“So they’re better off to say, in 2035 there’s a second team in New Zealand, but between now and then we are investing and growing the game and taking over that country.

“We can help them with that.

“But it would be devastating in my view if they threw one (team in Christchurch) now and they’re sending all their teams over with us to play in Australia.”

Robinson echoed George’s position when asked to consider the three New Zealand bids, which have included the Southern Orcas based in Christchurch and run by former Kiwis coach Graham Lowe, a South Island bid led by former Canterbury Rugby League chair Tony Kidd and ex-Kiwis and Warriors coach Frank Endacott and the Keas overseen by Moffett.

“It comes back to our local league comps here. Auckland Rugby League is in a shambles, there’s no real senior competition,” Robinson said. “Schoolboys are strong up until the age of about 13 and then there’s nothing.

“They go and play rugby union.

“The local competitions are at least 10 to 15 years away from having the right amount of decent players to even run a second team.”

 

[Noitall]

Sorry I don’t know how to copy and paste off my phone from the Daily Telegraph.
Story on DT of Cameron George and Mark Robinson saying the CHCH team is a mistake.
The timing is not right, they want the NRL to invest in NZ to get the local comp up to QLD comp standard which could take 5-10 years etc etc
CHCH teams must be spewing with the Warriors coming out and openly saying the NRL shouldn’t proceed at this time.

Interesting seeing that nrl most powerful 50 list in recent times and seeing Robinson in it, though late 40’s. Could actually have a bearing what he’s got to say?

 

[WA Warrior]

Interesting seeing that nrl most powerful 50 list in recent times and seeing Robinson in it, though late 40’s. Could actually have a bearing what he’s got to say?

You would assume so hey.
Also the NRL go to every team for input etc before accepting a team in an expansion.
I agree with Cam and Mark in regards to investing in the local game in NZ though.
Imagine getting the local league up to a genuinely good standard.
Rugby players not making NPC would have a crack, could be like the old Bartercard Cup on steroids.

 

[Noitall]

You would assume so hey.
Also the NRL go to every team for input etc before accepting a team in an expansion.
I agree with Cam and Mark in regards to investing in the local game in NZ though.
Imagine getting the local league up to a genuinely good standard.
Rugby players not making NPC would have a crack, could be like the old Bartercard Cup on steroids.

Must be tempting for nrl revenue wise and timing wise with Warriors on a high and union in a lull in NZ though. Warriors aren’t just selling out home games, their games against Aussie opponents in Aussie are seeing bigger crowds too. There’s the rivalry between Phoenix and Auckland fc showing potential for something similar in League? Will be interesting to watch

 

[WA Warrior]

Must be tempting for nrl revenue wise and timing wise with Warriors on a high and union in a lull in NZ though. Warriors aren’t just selling out home games, their games against Aussie opponents in Aussie are seeing bigger crowds too. There’s the rivalry between Phoenix and Auckland fc showing potential for something similar in League? Will be interesting to watch

100%
Could be a great way to add quality to the player pool with 3 new teams.
Seems like a perfect time and opportunity.

 

[Tohu’s_Knees]

If I was Mark Robinson and Cam George I’d be a little annoyed about a second NRL team coming to NZ. You can’t say this isn’t a conflict of interest to them though.

They seem to have gone to the media to convey their message in a united way. I don’t blame them. Anything that will directly affect their business they’re certainly going to have an opinion.
There’s certainly a worry about losing the exclusivity of being the only NZ NRL team and merchandise sales are bound to take a hit. And Mark Robinson has supposedly pumped a lot of money into the game in NZ just for another team to come along.

I hope that the NRL starts with a NSW/Queensland cup team before going to the South Island. In 2027. That’ll at least give them something. (I actually prefer this option as it will likely benefit the Warriors more)

Few questions….
When Robinson says it’ll take 10-15 years. What does he mean by that? That’s pretty broad.
How would they explain Melbourne and Perth? Especially Melbourne, they’re actually in the NRL.
How much will an NZ expansion team affect the bottom line of the Warriors? They have every right to be upset about this.

What will Mark Robinson do with the licensing fee? lol

 

[hornbybrown]

Of course people associated with the warriors are going to say we can’t sustain two teams. Take that with a grain of salt

 

[John Nick]

Of course people associated with the warriors are going to say we can’t sustain two teams. Take that with a grain of salt

Will be a very long time before any new kiwi teams will be competitive.
Warriors are struggling to keep up after nearly 30 years in the comp and struggling to recruit Aussie players.
Even clubs like the Gold Coast with pokies and all the benefits took 3 cracks to get established.