NRL NRL Expansion

[hornbybrown]

And kidwell.

I’m talking about Christchurch based players that played for the warriors

 

[Matiunz]

Would love to see the bears and jets back in. Couple of retro games at Henson Park and north Sydney oval. Plenty of NSW pokie money to prop them up. Relocation of existing teams has worked in AFL as opposed to new teams.

PNG is a given. US and Aus money will make it so. Might be based out of Cairns and have Fifo to Port Moresby. Flight time is only 60 minutes so no problem. Big problem would be to get families to relocate to PNG which is rough as but Cairns would be a much easier sell and likely to last…

I’ve played at Henson park there’s no way it can hold an NRL match- pre season maybe.
Both Cowboys and PNG are opposed to a Cairns base

 

[Bushman]

I’ve played at Henson park there’s no way it can hold an NRL match- pre season maybe.
Both Cowboys and PNG are opposed to a Cairns base

Far North Queensland might not mind the PNG Cowboys. As a thought, stay based in FNQ with 50% home games at Townsville, 25% FNQ 25% PNG.
As sweetener for PNG and a bit of mana they keep cowboys Qcup team and also get PNG hunters as bonus feeder club.
Would like to see all the Sydney teams play another home game outside NSW ideally against team from that state/country.
I know a few Sydney teams take a home game interstate, Eels play a game most years in Darwin, also normally a game in Perth as well.
Or prehaps with the right coach, and support they can field a team solely from PNG, home games in port Moresby would be something else

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

I’ve played at Henson park there’s no way it can hold an NRL match- pre season maybe.
Both Cowboys and PNG are opposed to a Cairns base

Wouldn’t a condition be the ground is upgraded with Australian/ US money if it’s all political?

PNG team don't want to be based out of Cairns. Which will make it nearly impossible to get outside talent.

It may come down to based in Queensland = franchise or it’s not going to happen.

Strategically they could base in Queensland with the idea to relocate to PNG in say 10 years when the clubs established and certain criteria are met (eg murder rate falls below x amount). Conditions that may never be met and never relocate but get past the short term roadblocks.

 

[Kav1]

Dunno if selling 4000 tickets would be much of a stretch, or financially viable

but those 4000 would really appreciate the gesture and would feel part of the set up.

 

[Kav1]

More pathways is huge, I’m almost certain player numbers in juniors ranks would go up big time in Christchurch if they had a team based there.
A NZ rivalry would be huge, so much more money flowing into the NZ game.
So many more kiwi kids would be able to stay in NZ. There are even kids from Dunedin that go to Australia for an opportunity. Sure their families would rather they drive four hours up the road that that.
The game in Christchurch loses lots of players every year to Aussie feeder teams or even just bush footy teams.

Guys like Griffin Neame would have been recruited rather than travelling to N.T. Cowboys. Note that a team of coasters travel through the Alps each week to play in the Christchurch club competition.
These are guys with league in their blood and prime candidates for the S.I. franchise.

 

[Kav1]

The Canberra and Newcastle teams didn’t start up directly competing with union as the established main local sport.

Coming in as a second pro rugby team in a less popular local sport is going to be tough.

Need great marketing, a handful of genuine stars and success in the field straight away to build a following.

"Super Rugby" not so super anymore. Crowds are poor and the rules not conducive to open, fast moving action. Note the Warriors v West Tigers trial game attracted 16,000 fans

 

[Lord Gnome of Waiheke]

"Super Rugby" not so super anymore. Crowds are poor and the rules not conducive to open, fast moving action. Note the Warriors v West Tigers trial game attracted 16,000 fans

I caught the highlights of the last Crusaders game - doubt there was 8,000 in attendance.

 

[Riz]

I caught the highlights of the last Crusaders game - doubt there was 8,000 in attendance.

I've seen a lot of comment online that the fans are jumping off the Crusaders wagon because they're loosing but the crowd numbers were pretty similar last season when we won the title.

 

[juju]

A League attendance is really bad.

Phoenix having their best season ever and can't seem to capture the public's imagination.
Averaging 8k with their best attendance being in Auckland.

Attendance Statistics :: Totals / Averages :: Ultimate A-League

From the Attendance Statistics section, you access crowd statistics for all A-League Men's competition seasons and matches.

www.ultimatealeague.com

Meanwhile the NRL is flying

 

[hornbybrown]

"Super Rugby" not so super anymore. Crowds are poor and the rules not conducive to open, fast moving action. Note the Warriors v West Tigers trial game attracted 16,000 fans

The state of rugby is the reason why now is the time to strike. This is coming from someone who played till I was 43

 

[Wrighty]

"Super Rugby" not so super anymore. Crowds are poor and the rules not conducive to open, fast moving action. Note the Warriors v West Tigers trial game attracted 16,000 fans

I watched the Crusaders vs Chiefs on Saturday and it was surprisingly free flowing and whistle free but that may have been an anomaly. Could have been the particular ref though. It was Angus Gardner from Aussie and he is on the elite panel.

 

[Wrighty]

The only team I am in favour of expanding to is PNG I have decided as they can fill their team with PNG players and have a distinct talent pool rather than planning on competing with everyone else for talent.
Take a look at the Titans 17 this weekend. If the Titans could find better talent they would sign it but there is none available. The Keas or Perth Bears will for the first few seasons have a roster worse than the Titans and that will make them a prank side not worth watching. It will just be too hard for the expansion franchise to get players.
When the NHL teams expand the head office helps the new team by holding an expansion draft. Each existing NHL team can only protect say 25 players which allows the new team to nab veterans on the outer who are still wanted like the equivalent of a TMM and up and comers who are highly thought of from other cubs. Just saying to a new club "You have to start from scratch and compete with every other man and dog to make a roster of 30" is unreasonable. I don't know how the Dolphins did so well but I remember they took a long time to sign anybody as they kept getting knocked back.
No to expansion until the 16th and 17th ranked teams in the NRL look more competitive.

 

[Kav1]

I watched the Crusaders vs Chiefs on Saturday and it was surprisingly free flowing and whistle free but that may have been an anomaly. Could have been the particular ref though. It was Angus Gardner from Aussie and he is on the elite panel.

I think that the bosses of NZ Rugby are so alarmed at the poor crowds and ratings that they have encouraged refs to promote running football and less stoppages for minor offences. I could be wrong as I don't watch the game anymore.

 

[Kav1]

The only team I am in favour of expanding to is PNG I have decided as they can fill their team with PNG players and have a distinct talent pool rather than planning on competing with everyone else for talent.
Take a look at the Titans 17 this weekend. If the Titans could find better talent they would sign it but there is none available. The Keas or Perth Bears will for the first few seasons have a roster worse than the Titans and that will make them a prank side not worth watching. It will just be too hard for the expansion franchise to get players.
When the NHL teams expand the head office helps the new team by holding an expansion draft. Each existing NHL team can only protect say 25 players which allows the new team to nab veterans on the outer who are still wanted like the equivalent of a TMM and up and comers who are highly thought of from other cubs. Just saying to a new club "You have to start from scratch and compete with every other man and dog to make a roster of 30" is unreasonable. I don't know how the Dolphins did so well but I remember they took a long time to sign anybody as they kept getting knocked back.
No to expansion until the 16th and 17th ranked teams in the NRL look more competitive.

With significant financial support and other measures such as increases in the salary cap, the NRL could offer the new clubs the opportunities to establish and grow themselves. There will always be financial backing and sponsor support. The catchment area would also play a big part. The Dolphins (Redcliff) have made significant progress from their first season with some astute buying (not forgetting the coach). The Titans have been hovering around the bottom eight but have had their moments too. Up to this season, they have been an exciting team to watch if not quite making the grade. The amalgamation of some Sydney clubs would broaden the number of players available. All this would take time and be introduced gradually but let's be positive in taking advantage of what appears to be a surge in the popularity of our sport.

 

[Matiunz]

I watched the Crusaders vs Chiefs on Saturday and it was surprisingly free flowing and whistle free but that may have been an anomaly. Could have been the particular ref though. It was Angus Gardner from Aussie and he is on the elite panel.

Canes have been a good team to watch this year some pretty decent running rugby. Part of the decline is rules favouring a more forward focused game that then invites a lot more ref involvement in close contact, the northern teams play this style moreso than down south.

 

[Matiunz]

The only team I am in favour of expanding to is PNG I have decided as they can fill their team with PNG players and have a distinct talent pool rather than planning on competing with everyone else for talent.
Take a look at the Titans 17 this weekend. If the Titans could find better talent they would sign it but there is none available. The Keas or Perth Bears will for the first few seasons have a roster worse than the Titans and that will make them a prank side not worth watching. It will just be too hard for the expansion franchise to get players.
When the NHL teams expand the head office helps the new team by holding an expansion draft. Each existing NHL team can only protect say 25 players which allows the new team to nab veterans on the outer who are still wanted like the equivalent of a TMM and up and comers who are highly thought of from other cubs. Just saying to a new club "You have to start from scratch and compete with every other man and dog to make a roster of 30" is unreasonable. I don't know how the Dolphins did so well but I remember they took a long time to sign anybody as they kept getting knocked back.
No to expansion until the 16th and 17th ranked teams in the NRL look more competitive.

PNG unfortunately just doesn’t have a level of players high enough just yet. Putting in local players and you end up essentially with the Hunters who for the most part are a mid level QLD cup team. Olam is about their only NRL quality player of note, it’d be like putting a NZ team in made up of boy local comp players.
Titans really should be doing better, Kebra park is arguably one of the best schools at producing talent on their doorstep but the stink of failure means QLD players pick Brisbane and now even Dolphins over them.

 

[Horriors2013]

There’s a couple of big factors in expansion;
1.Who is going to pay for it?
2.Where are the players coming from?
Been talk over in Aus about taking a “safe bid” then “risky bid” approach for expansion. When I say “Safe bid” I mean the like of Brisbane Tigers/Brisbane 3
Ie a Dolphins type scenario where the QLD cup team is essentially ‘promoted’ to the NRL with its own pre established pathways, sponsors and financial assists in place.
The other type of “safe bid” is Jets/Bears, now the NRL knows that there’s no room for another NSW team but rather again promoting a nsw cup team to an expansion area tapping into its brand and pre established pathways etc- this is shaping up as the likely Perth outcome.
“Risky bids”
PNG - government money takes care of the funding (for now) the players are the hard bit with this bid. Strong political pressure for this to happen.
Fiji - again after government funding, big likely sponsor in Fiji Airways which doubles as solid tourism investment, players a better prospect. Infrastructure is maybe the one hiccup.
NZ2- Not sure how the funding stacks up, not sure the player pathways stack up, we’d be reliant on a few ‘NZ imports’ aka current NRL players with NZ attachments coming over. But in terms of players from scratch probably one of the more likely prospects compared to other expansion markets.
TV then has a big say,
next expansion is easiest to push up the tv deal as it’s another game if content, next one will have to be something the broadcasters want for them to pay more, and supposedly that’s Brisbane 3, however Perth is at least Australian content- NZ2/PNG/Fiji hold little value to Australian broadcasters. Sky more than funds the Warriors, depending on how much more they can pay would have a huge say in NZ2.

So in orders if safest bid to Riskiest bid I’d put them in this order;
Brisbane 3
Perth
NZ2
Fiji
PNG

As it’s all but confirmed we are moving towards 20 teams my crystal ball tells me
18 Perth (with Bears)
19 NZ2
20 Brisbane 3

Think PNG really will be in the too hard basket and it will only get in as team 18 with extreme political pressure, wouldn’t surprise me if a combined Fiji/PNG was considered.

Brisbane 3 won't be strong. Titans suck, how is a 4th team going to prosper against a Chch team which has the whole Sth Island behind it and plenty of Crusaders cast-offs? Perth doesn't have the passion to sustain it. AFL far bigger I believe. Fiji and PNG is a pipe dream. Politically unstable decision IMO.

 

[Horriors2013]

And kidwell.

Mike Doreen, Logan Edwards

 

[Falcon]

I wonder if St Thomas College in ChCh could become a development school like Keebra Park? Run by a well respected ( and Warriors satellite pathways coach) Andrew Auimatangi.
This would be a nice piece of business for any expansion side out of ChCh.