Staff Andrew Webster

[Worried2Death]

The two sports I follow are NRL (rugby league) and NHL (ice hockey), I've noticed lately a huge difference in the way the games are coached on the fly.

The setup is easier in hockey; the coach is standing behind the team, the players rotate constantly, they can also call a timeout (usually used for a team talk to try and change momentum). Teams start with 4 forward lines and 3 defence pairings, but a coach will juggle these lines during a game, and sit players out completely if they need to. These coaches seem way more on top of a game, constantly reacting to what's in front of them.

In comparison rugby league coaches are sitting up in a box miles away, and have just one chance at half time to address the full team. Our coaches seem to have predetermined ideas about processes or gameplans or whatever, and the team can't go off this script. It also seems like interchanges are part of these plans and only ever change for injuries, rather than reading the game and reacting to what's needed on the field, or as a way to change in momentum.

Some of the better teams have players who can analyse a game and react accordingly. If one of the opposition is limping or struggling to get into position on the right side, how likely are we to shift that way and target them? I'd say there's a 99% chance the bomb will still go up on the other side as per usual.

I guess what I'm saying is, what I don't like about Andrew Webster's coaching style is that there seems to be just one plan, and if it doesn't work out, we're done for. This year it's reminding me of unsuccessful past coaches.

Also no game plan is ever going to work if players constantly drop balls and miss tackles, those are fundamentals that all professionals are able to do, something must be mentally affecting the team this year.

I think NRL coaches can make reactive tactical/positional decisions on the fly, that's what water runners are for. Not as instant as NHL coaches granted.

 

[Makasene]

This all feels pretty spot on as usual, mate.

It seems there could be a number of things bubbling under the surface at the club, that finally came to a head possibly in the lead up to this game where it boiled over.

Webby has made some very strange decisions throughout the year, which have appeared very odd and rigid at times with selection, bench use, and style of play.

So as we know it SJ didn't train from after the Manly game through till the pec injury in the Roosters game only doing captain's run each week. Yet we still ran all the attack and kicking through him for that month, despite it being completely worked out in the Dragons game and then onwards. During that run of losses we also had major middle injuries, and rather than bringing anyone up from cup or giving someone like Ale a bigger role. He instead went the route of running our senior middles at the red line minutes wise. Even having unused bench players at times, ala Roache who we saw in the Riff game as being more than capable.

It wasn't until the Riff game when his hand was forced with that we saw a change in game style with TMM taking the reins and the injection of some youthful energy/speed. This followed through into Phins game, and then also into the Cows game with Tohu now back in but on the bench where he should be so that was fine. Now while this run of games weren't perfect they definitely showed where we had been going wrong and what had been missing. It did strike me as odd that he mentioned in one of those post match pressers he didn't know TMM was able to do some of what he was doing.

The Storm game comes along which was always going to be tough, and then adding SJ back into the mix threw another spanner in the works. To me SJ was near invisible in that game, and everything good we did came on the left side anyway. There appeared to be a tug of war at times, and we played far slower and less direct than with the TMM/CHT in for those previous weeks.

Now something has to have boiled over during the week or pre game for the whole squad to just decide today we all aren't going to turn up and let the wheels completely fall off.

When I saw the teamlist on the Tuesday I thought it was Webby playing his weird games and there was no way we line up that way come kick off. He could have picked any number of combinations that wasn't what he did. Ford edge, Walker 13, Tohu prop or Ale in there and Tohu to bench. Laban was there and has proven to be solid also. Kosi another start after the Roosters game, when MGT proved his worth in the Phins game and could have easily played centre with Roger on the wing. In the second 20 of the first half I could swear we had Walker edge, Ford and Jazz props, with CHT as 13, with Egan not a Robson type also in there. That honestly just makes no sense whatsoever. He then held Laban and Ale on the bench till the 55th minute when Roger was sent to the bin.

Alarm bells were ringing in my ears at an ear piercing level watching and after that game. There was all sorts of sniping going on between players throughout the game, and players you can put the house on to give you 100% effort every week without fail were just as bad as the others.

It feels like there is three plausible issues that are bubbling away.

- Junior players showing they are more than worthy of holding spots in grade or being called upon when injuries occur. But instead Webby is going completely different routes which could be frustrating younger players and possibly even senior players who think the juniors are more worthy.
- A group in the team feel that TMM should be running the team, and then possibly others that still think it should be SJ.
- The AFB situation has been gathering steam throughout the season and is now starting to cause major issues in the playing group.

Tomorrow will be a very interesting list, but given what we've seen from Webby I'm not expecting much change. SJ out with injury, TMM handed the keys again with CHT at 6. Barnett will be back on the left edge after 18th man on Weds. DWZ back in for Kosi on the right. Tohu back to the bench with Walker starting at lock. If he somehow manages to get the rise out of them and we win both games with TMM into the bye, then it becomes a very tricky situation with SJ. But I'm not sure if much can change unless he really digs into that loss, and gets to the bottom of what is bubbling away with the miriad of possible issues.

Just some rambling thoughts anyway, not sure how coherent they are.

I can't think of any organisation that would be humming if those at the bottom working their backsides off don't get the rewards they deserve.

At the moment, if you're a high performing reserve grader at the Warriors, it's almost impossible to break into the team of Dads army.

If you do break into the team, you can expect to head back to reserve grade regardless of how you perform.

If you are lucky enough to nab a bench spot, don't expect to be used in any meaningful way.

You can't be a development club if you don't give the opportunities.

The only way this situation gets worse is if we start losing these talents like Parramatta seem to do.

I pray it doesn't come to that.

 

[Brightman]

When will Webster realize that reserve grade is an option for senior players returning to the field or form..

 

[Brightman]

There seems to be deep disharmony within the squad.

Imo selection is the cure, in hindsight it's obvious the attitude of entitlement from first grade players contracts greatly to the younger players gunning for a spot in the top side.

Automatic selection negates form..

 

[#robbiemears]

I can't think of any organisation that would be humming if those at the bottom working their backsides off don't get the rewards they deserve.

At the moment, if you're a high performing reserve grader at the Warriors, it's almost impossible to break into the team of Dads army.

If you do break into the team, you can expect to head back to reserve grade regardless of how you perform.

If you are lucky enough to nab a bench spot, don't expect to be used in any meaningful way.

You can't be a development club if you don't give the opportunities.

The only way this situation gets worse is if we start losing these talents like Parramatta seem to do.

I pray it doesn't come to that.

While all this drama is playing out in the NRL team, the Cup side have won 7 and drawn 1 in their last 9 games. These young guns are in form and hungry for a chance. Frustration must be rife.

 

[Rick O’Shay]

When will Webster realize that reserve grade is an option for senior players returning to the field or form..

I think he knows that but is afraid to make the call with some over inflated egos standing in the way.

When Montoya got dropped, did he actually play cup that weekend?

 

[defensivebomb]

While I agree that selection is an issue, and that there are players in reserve grade that should be promoted, we've been pumped 16-104 in the last 140 minutes of play (6-66 against the lowest-placed team). That sort of scoreline is more than just incumbents that are out of form. Particularly when the ones that should be disenfranchised didn't take to the field

The team that played over the weekend has basically just spent the last 140 minutes of play walking back from their tryline to do yet another kick off into the opposition

 

[snake77]

While all this drama is playing out in the NRL team, the Cup side have won 7 and drawn 1 in their last 9 games. These young guns are in form and hungry for a chance. Frustration must be rife.

Down 4-0 on the weekend and then scored 18 unanswered points. A pretty strong second half as well. The weekends team was also impressive as they also had guys out with injuries.

These guys were all missing. There may be a few more but these are the guys I am familiar with.
Leiataua
Mau'u
Roache
Doyle

The Roosters game and this weekend my fall back was well the Warriors side I went to see won. So I'm a bit mixed about having these big names that are not performing polluting that side which is winning. Not sure they deserve being promoted to NSW Cup.

Jokes aside there are few guys in there that deserve to be looked at.

 

[Christchurch_Warrior]

When Montoya got dropped, did he actually play cup that weekend?

He did and was the Warrior that made the most meters.

 

[Rick O’Shay]

He did and was the Warrior that made the most meters.

So we can say that pathway works if tried. (for a player with the right attitude)

 

[Brightman]

I think he knows that but is afraid to make the call with some over inflated egos standing in the way.

When Montoya got dropped, did he actually play cup that weekend?

Yes Montoya did play cup and had a blinder, very poignant example you point to..

Time to man up Webster and make some hard decisions for this season's sake AND the future!!

 

[CWC]

While I agree that selection is an issue, and that there are players in reserve grade that should be promoted, we've been pumped 16-104 in the last 140 minutes of play (6-66 against the lowest-placed team). That sort of scoreline is more than just incumbents that are out of form. Particularly when the ones that should be disenfranchised didn't take to the field

The team that played over the weekend has basically just spent the last 140 minutes of play walking back from their tryline to do yet another kick off into the opposition

This. It's weird the guys missing out aren't even in the team, or they came off the bench and actually played hard. Yet your regular team collapses like this.

Could it be the guys that were there pulling miracles last month, having contempt or feeling sick of de javu when the old guys came back?

 

[PNG Kiwi]

Imo selection is the cure, in hindsight it's obvious the attitude of entitlement from first grade players contracts greatly to the younger players gunning for a spot in the top side.

Automatic selection negates form..

The same thing happened in the Cappy days, remember the pills and energy drink saga. The reserve team replaced the players that were stood down and won then kicked into touch.
This is history repeating itself.
Lest we forget.

 

[Brightman]

The same thing happened in the Cappy days, remember the pills and energy drink saga. The reserve team replaced the players that were stood down and won then kicked into touch.
This is history repeating itself.
Lest we forget.

So Cappy is responsible??

 

[Sir Arrow]

This all feels pretty spot on as usual, mate.

It seems there could be a number of things bubbling under the surface at the club, that finally came to a head possibly in the lead up to this game where it boiled over.

Webby has made some very strange decisions throughout the year, which have appeared very odd and rigid at times with selection, bench use, and style of play.

So as we know it SJ didn't train from after the Manly game through till the pec injury in the Roosters game only doing captain's run each week. Yet we still ran all the attack and kicking through him for that month, despite it being completely worked out in the Dragons game and then onwards. During that run of losses we also had major middle injuries, and rather than bringing anyone up from cup or giving someone like Ale a bigger role. He instead went the route of running our senior middles at the red line minutes wise. Even having unused bench players at times, ala Roache who we saw in the Riff game as being more than capable.

It wasn't until the Riff game when his hand was forced with that we saw a change in game style with TMM taking the reins and the injection of some youthful energy/speed. This followed through into Phins game, and then also into the Cows game with Tohu now back in but on the bench where he should be so that was fine. Now while this run of games weren't perfect they definitely showed where we had been going wrong and what had been missing. It did strike me as odd that he mentioned in one of those post match pressers he didn't know TMM was able to do some of what he was doing.

The Storm game comes along which was always going to be tough, and then adding SJ back into the mix threw another spanner in the works. To me SJ was near invisible in that game, and everything good we did came on the left side anyway. There appeared to be a tug of war at times, and we played far slower and less direct than with the TMM/CHT in for those previous weeks.

Now something has to have boiled over during the week or pre game for the whole squad to just decide today we all aren't going to turn up and let the wheels completely fall off.

When I saw the teamlist on the Tuesday I thought it was Webby playing his weird games and there was no way we line up that way come kick off. He could have picked any number of combinations that wasn't what he did. Ford edge, Walker 13, Tohu prop or Ale in there and Tohu to bench. Laban was there and has proven to be solid also. Kosi another start after the Roosters game, when MGT proved his worth in the Phins game and could have easily played centre with Roger on the wing. In the second 20 of the first half I could swear we had Walker edge, Ford and Jazz props, with CHT as 13, with Egan not a Robson type also in there. That honestly just makes no sense whatsoever. He then held Laban and Ale on the bench till the 55th minute when Roger was sent to the bin.

Alarm bells were ringing in my ears at an ear piercing level watching and after that game. There was all sorts of sniping going on between players throughout the game, and players you can put the house on to give you 100% effort every week without fail were just as bad as the others.

It feels like there is three plausible issues that are bubbling away.

- Junior players showing they are more than worthy of holding spots in grade or being called upon when injuries occur. But instead Webby is going completely different routes which could be frustrating younger players and possibly even senior players who think the juniors are more worthy.
- A group in the team feel that TMM should be running the team, and then possibly others that still think it should be SJ.
- The AFB situation has been gathering steam throughout the season and is now starting to cause major issues in the playing group.

Tomorrow will be a very interesting list, but given what we've seen from Webby I'm not expecting much change. SJ out with injury, TMM handed the keys again with CHT at 6. Barnett will be back on the left edge after 18th man on Weds. DWZ back in for Kosi on the right. Tohu back to the bench with Walker starting at lock. If he somehow manages to get the rise out of them and we win both games with TMM into the bye, then it becomes a very tricky situation with SJ. But I'm not sure if much can change unless he really digs into that loss, and gets to the bottom of what is bubbling away with the miriad of possible issues.

Just some rambling thoughts anyway, not sure how coherent they are.

This post was coherent AF by the way, quality

 

[juju]

There seems to be deep disharmony within the squad.

I did hear a couple of weeks back from somebody involved with the players wives via the media, that some of the players wives had beef and needed a "senior" wife to intervene.

I thought nothing of it but in the context of what's unfolding this could be a part.

 

[Blain]

I did hear a couple of weeks back from somebody involved with the players wives via the media, that some of the players wives had beef and needed a "senior" wife to intervene.

I thought nothing of it but in the context of what's unfolding this could be a part.

Far out that's a new one.. Keep the bloody wives out of it fellas! Jesus Christ.. PRetty hard for Webby to take care of that shit show

 

[PNG Kiwi]

So Cappy is responsible??

Remember Cappy was a young coach then, so is Webster, although coach of the year is relatively inexperienced.
Payton also went through a dry spell the year after he won coach of the year.
How would Wayne handle this? Hint he recognises used by date.

 

[Rick O’Shay]

I did hear a couple of weeks back from somebody involved with the players wives via the media, that some of the players wives had beef and needed a "senior" wife to intervene.

I thought nothing of it but in the context of what's unfolding this could be a part.

Maybe they refused to have cookies at their afternoon get togethers and went down the cup cake route

 

[Hitro]

This all feels pretty spot on as usual, mate.

It seems there could be a number of things bubbling under the surface at the club, that finally came to a head possibly in the lead up to this game where it boiled over.

Webby has made some very strange decisions throughout the year, which have appeared very odd and rigid at times with selection, bench use, and style of play.

So as we know it SJ didn't train from after the Manly game through till the pec injury in the Roosters game only doing captain's run each week. Yet we still ran all the attack and kicking through him for that month, despite it being completely worked out in the Dragons game and then onwards. During that run of losses we also had major middle injuries, and rather than bringing anyone up from cup or giving someone like Ale a bigger role. He instead went the route of running our senior middles at the red line minutes wise. Even having unused bench players at times, ala Roache who we saw in the Riff game as being more than capable.

It wasn't until the Riff game when his hand was forced with that we saw a change in game style with TMM taking the reins and the injection of some youthful energy/speed. This followed through into Phins game, and then also into the Cows game with Tohu now back in but on the bench where he should be so that was fine. Now while this run of games weren't perfect they definitely showed where we had been going wrong and what had been missing. It did strike me as odd that he mentioned in one of those post match pressers he didn't know TMM was able to do some of what he was doing.

The Storm game comes along which was always going to be tough, and then adding SJ back into the mix threw another spanner in the works. To me SJ was near invisible in that game, and everything good we did came on the left side anyway. There appeared to be a tug of war at times, and we played far slower and less direct than with the TMM/CHT in for those previous weeks.

Now something has to have boiled over during the week or pre game for the whole squad to just decide today we all aren't going to turn up and let the wheels completely fall off.

When I saw the teamlist on the Tuesday I thought it was Webby playing his weird games and there was no way we line up that way come kick off. He could have picked any number of combinations that wasn't what he did. Ford edge, Walker 13, Tohu prop or Ale in there and Tohu to bench. Laban was there and has proven to be solid also. Kosi another start after the Roosters game, when MGT proved his worth in the Phins game and could have easily played centre with Roger on the wing. In the second 20 of the first half I could swear we had Walker edge, Ford and Jazz props, with CHT as 13, with Egan not a Robson type also in there. That honestly just makes no sense whatsoever. He then held Laban and Ale on the bench till the 55th minute when Roger was sent to the bin.

Alarm bells were ringing in my ears at an ear piercing level watching and after that game. There was all sorts of sniping going on between players throughout the game, and players you can put the house on to give you 100% effort every week without fail were just as bad as the others.

It feels like there is three plausible issues that are bubbling away.

- Junior players showing they are more than worthy of holding spots in grade or being called upon when injuries occur. But instead Webby is going completely different routes which could be frustrating younger players and possibly even senior players who think the juniors are more worthy.
- A group in the team feel that TMM should be running the team, and then possibly others that still think it should be SJ.
- The AFB situation has been gathering steam throughout the season and is now starting to cause major issues in the playing group.

Tomorrow will be a very interesting list, but given what we've seen from Webby I'm not expecting much change. SJ out with injury, TMM handed the keys again with CHT at 6. Barnett will be back on the left edge after 18th man on Weds. DWZ back in for Kosi on the right. Tohu back to the bench with Walker starting at lock. If he somehow manages to get the rise out of them and we win both games with TMM into the bye, then it becomes a very tricky situation with SJ. But I'm not sure if much can change unless he really digs into that loss, and gets to the bottom of what is bubbling away with the miriad of possible issues.

Just some rambling thoughts anyway, not sure how coherent they are.

Spot on, best summary of what’s causing the winter of discontent yet IMO