Politics 🗳️ NZ Politics

[wizard of Tauranga]

Fuel prices could be hurting getting the helicopter out for a run too. At least labour is willing to freeze their pay unlike national when they’re doing a cunt of a job

Not defending MP’s pay but:

- Backbench MP: about $160k–$170k
- Cabinet Ministers: roughly $290k–$320k
- Prime Minister: around $470k+

For comparison, Wayne Brown, mayor of Auckland $318k, public service head - those under the MP’s typically earn $400k–$800k+

Honestly, an MP’s a shit job with crushingly intense public scrutiny and you are better just working in a public department for more money. Hence the mediocre politicians we end up with.

 

[Beastmode]

The current superman villain lux luthor as sitting pm has shown why as much as they are cunts, they’re special cunts and a ceo in the role isn’t cutting the mustard often trying to slink into the shadows and let everyone else front. I couldn’t believe at Christmas that he didn’t have the balls to front on our one political show and least offer some optimism in trying times. I would say he’s about to be rolled and not before time, learning on the fly hasn’t worked but that party is full of a special breed that the successor is going to be interesting

i haven’t been impressed with the Robert Muldoon impersonator either

They’re all idiots which explains the current state of NZ

 

[miket12]

i haven’t been impressed with the Robert Muldoon impersonator either

They’re all idiots which explains the current state of NZ

Scary thing is, I trust GrantR to do a better job than both Willis or Edmond as Finance Minister….
and look at the crap position he left the country in…… I actually miss the days of Cullen and English.

 

[Noitall]

Not defending MP’s pay but:

- Backbench MP: about $160k–$170k
- Cabinet Ministers: roughly $290k–$320k
- Prime Minister: around $470k+

For comparison, Wayne Brown, mayor of Auckland $318k, public service head - those under the MP’s typically earn $400k–$800k+

Honestly, an MP’s a shit job with crushingly intense public scrutiny and you are better just working in a public department for more money. Hence the mediocre politicians we end up with.

It’s a calling just like a nurse or teacher often where it needs to go further than a job. I’m not suggesting that that they shouldn’t be compensated but when results are what the rest of us are held to, then this should be no different. Of course we have the ability to vote someone else in if enough are unhappy with what’s being served but public servants is what they are when taxpayers pay their salaries and I think taxpayers deserve the right to decide if they deserve a pay rise or not? They have perks that go through the rest of their lives and an employer decides if their employee deserves a pay rise, which is what we are by voting them in-their employer

 

[Noitall]

Scary thing is, I trust GrantR to do a better job than both Willis or Edmond as Finance Minister….
and look at the crap position he left the country in…… I actually miss the days of Cullen and English.

Cullen was too smug sitting on that big surplus. English was good, just not a leader

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Scary thing is, I trust GrantR to do a better job than both Willis or Edmond as Finance Minister….
and look at the crap position he left the country in…… I actually miss the days of Cullen and English.

Robertson was the worst finance minister EVER.

$30b pissed away under his watch, nothing substantial done (Kiwibuild/ airport tram) and they left us with an even worse infrastructure deficit.

He ruined the country which were all paying for now.

 

[Damo]

Robertson was the worst finance minister EVER.

$30b pissed away under his watch, nothing substantial done (Kiwibuild/ airport tram) and they left us with an even worse infrastructure deficit.

He ruined the country which were all paying for now.

Agree with nothing substantial being done but calling Robertson the worst ever ignores that he managed a unprecedented crisis without the country going under.

That $30B was largely spent keeping the workforce employed with the wage subsidy, without it there would have been mass liquidations and double digit unemployment. Couple with that spending, the net debt was significantly lower than almost any other OECD nation and maintained our AAA credit rating throughout. The infrastructure deficit is a 30 year issue, that neither National or Labour have fixed but he actually put more capital there than his predecessors.

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Agree with nothing substantial being done but calling Robertson the worst ever ignores that he managed a unprecedented crisis without the country going under.

That $30B was largely spent keeping the workforce employed with the wage subsidy, without it there would have been mass liquidations and double digit unemployment. Couple with that spending, the net debt was significantly lower than almost any other OECD nation and maintained our AAA credit rating throughout. The infrastructure deficit is a 30 year issue, that neither National or Labour have fixed but he actually put more capital there than his predecessors.

Agree he negotiated Covid and was decisive in assisting the economy. But:

$60b went to business and Covid spending. $30b was frittered away borrowing for nothing (as per Covid enquiry)

Even outside covid, core govt spending ratcheted up permanently, structurally encumbering future governments and locking in the long term deficit we are struggling to get out of.

 

[Damo]

Agree he negotiated Covid and was decisive in assisting the economy. But:

$60b went to business and Covid spending. $30b was frittered away borrowing for nothing (as per Covid enquiry)

Even outside covid, core govt spending ratcheted up permanently, structurally encumbering future governments and locking in the long term deficit we are struggling to get out of.

Fair distinction, but saying $30B was frittered is a misreading of the Inquiry. It was found that the $30B wasn't directly health related but much of it was for shock proofing of the economy specifically construction and hospitality.. and for the most part it worked.

Core government spending rose from 27% to 32% yes, but if you look where it went, a huge chunk is in NZ Super (which rises automatically) and there was also massive catch up spending on health and education. There's a structural deficit because we chose to finally fund the frontline properly rather than leave it on life support.

Every single developed nation is struggling after COVID with their deficits, our debt to GDP is 43%. We are lucky ours is half of what the US and the UK are dealing with.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Agree he negotiated Covid and was decisive in assisting the economy. But:

$60b went to business and Covid spending. $30b was frittered away borrowing for nothing (as per Covid enquiry)

Even outside covid, core govt spending ratcheted up permanently, structurally encumbering future governments and locking in the long term deficit we are struggling to get out of.

Looks like you're having problems with the truth again

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Looks like you're having problems with the truth again

Huh? We’re having a good respectful debate around our interpretation of govt spending.

Go back to playing with crayons if you can’t see that

 

[wizard of Tauranga]

Fair distinction, but saying $30B was frittered is a misreading of the Inquiry. It was found that the $30B wasn't directly health related but much of it was for shock proofing of the economy specifically construction and hospitality.. and for the most part it worked.

Core government spending rose from 27% to 32% yes, but if you look where it went, a huge chunk is in NZ Super (which rises automatically) and there was also massive catch up spending on health and education. There's a structural deficit because we chose to finally fund the frontline properly rather than leave it on life support.

Every single developed nation is struggling after COVID with their deficits, our debt to GDP is 43%. We are lucky ours is half of what the US and the UK are dealing with.

Another reason for my dislike of Robertson:

‘No new taxes’ - and specifically ruled out extending the brightline when questioned pre election.

Then once elected, increase the brightline to 10 years. Introduce landlord interest deductibility tax.

Then he smugly says after breaking election promises that were hammered for clarity pre election - ‘we were to literal’ - we lied!


As well as introducing the interest deducatability which was the dumbest tax in the world. No other country did it. Wasn’t supported by treasury. Made the whole rental market financially unviable. Forced huge rent increases on tenants.

Epic failure as a finance minister in my opinion.

 

[kos]

Cullen was too smug sitting on that big surplus. English was good, just not a leader

Bill English is a director on a few big Australasian Companies so he is rated as a smart guy.

 

[Noitall]

Bill English is a director on a few big Australasian Companies so he is rated as a smart guy.

He’s from the farming world, there’ll always be jobs for the likes of him

 

[Rick O’Shay]

He’s from the farming world, there’ll always be jobs for the likes of him

People forget at times that farming is a business, some are more successful than others. The biggest difference is when the debtor payments arrive and how you manage that.

 

[MaybeTop8]

Huh? We’re having a good respectful debate around our interpretation of govt spending.

Go back to playing with crayons if you can’t see that

Nope.

Huh? We’re having a good respectful debate around our interpretation of govt spending.

Go back to playing with crayons if you can’t see that

And yet your right wing economic ideology you believe in is an utter failure for all but the very rich

 

[Noitall]

Really impressed listening to Micheal Wood on q and a this morning. Made an absolute fuck up and still hard to understand why as it wasn’t particularly lucrative? Judith Collins showed there’s a road back after dismissal and I hope he makes it back too

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

Nope.
And yet your right wing economic ideology you believe in is an utter failure for all but the very rich

And if you’re correct then the majority will vote for change…. however that likely isn’t happening aye

 

[Noitall]

And if you’re correct then the majority will vote for change…. however that likely isn’t happening aye

Poll at 6 for a clearer indication of where things are currently. Long time until election though

 

[MaybeTop8]

And if you’re correct then the majority will vote for change…. however that likely isn’t happening aye

Problem is people don't vote based on which economic ideology is good for them long term, or overall most fair, or best for the well being of the country. The right leaning folk with money are well aware of this and take full advantage