General why change a winning team...

2big2strong_old

Guest
Yeah I'm more than happy to see how our new look backrow gel. With Luck we all know what we're gonna get, same with Feleti. 1 is all out defender and the other is all out attacker. I think the crucial balance of our backrow will fall directly into Mannerings hands. This year his attack has been nearly non-existent, however, i remember it was not all that long ago 2006,2007,2008, that he was hitting holes at will and really stretching the defense of other teams. I'm really hoping that he can manage to bring back some of that old form as well as keeping the starch in his defence.

I'm actually quite eager to see Steve Rapira move up to prop. He was a standout in 2009 for the Cowgirls, has the same leg drive as his brother and is a great set starter.
 

2big2strong_old

Guest
Is this the same mannering that last year suffered from fatigue because of playing too many games in a row and too many minutes in those games?

I think Mannering would be a better player if he was playing 65 minutes.


When did he suffer from fatigue? Or is this an excuse for us having a terrible 2009? If he was fatigued it wasn't from the amount of minutes he played, it was from the amount of games and subsequent flights he had to catch as he played 3 seasons without missing a game for the warriors or the Kiwi's

The thing with Mannering is that he plays exactly the same in the 78th minute as he does in the 3rd minute of the game.
 

Kaiaua krusher_old

Guest
I still maintain that Luck and Mannering were the key to holding the team together and the reason we made the 8. They denied dummy half runs from the best in the business, covered Maloneys missed tackles around the ruck and generally tidied up the middle third. Luck never the less gives me the tomtits on attack and should get out of the line - he's done his job.

Last couple of weeks it was good to see Lance and Maloney operating down the right side opening up opportunities for Tate and Nobby - this week it didn't happen, mainly because Prince and Rogers peppered the two little guys at the back. They spent a lot of time trying to run the ball back and just probably ran out of gas on support play.

Brown was all industry, but I think Luck and Seymour overcall a lot of plays and guys like Brown don't get the space or the time to use their skills. He was outstanding when Luck was off injured and tackled just as effectively.

I think Manu read to much press before this game - 2 cockups 2 tries and yet that idiot McIvor reckons the class players make up for it with a giant hit - even if the game is as good as lost.

A much improved season even though at times I despaired at the lack of go forward by our props - those kids have grown up and just imagine them with another 3-4 years under their belt and still aged in their mid 20's. Mateo will have a field day!!!!
 

DanKokoro_old

Guest
Lucks attacking game improved a lot this year.. Last year he was dreadful, he never made an inch after first point of contact with the defense and after every game i was flaming him for getting the ball far, far too much, particularly in the opposition red zone. He still gets the ball too much in the opposition 20 but he's imo he's looked much more of a threat.. I actually thought he had a really good attacking game against the Titans.. on a couple of occassions he made an extra 5-10 metres in the tackle. I really don't understand people who were putting some of the blame for our loss on him.


More than happy to have him in the squad next year, particularly if he continues to improve his attacking game. He's important to our squad not just for his individual skillset and relentless determination, but also for the confidence he would inspire in those around him. I'm really glad we didn't lose Brent Tate AND Michael Luck in the same season because i seriously think we'd see the effects of it next year. We need one or two of those guys that goes absolutely balls deep every game to act as a benchmark for the players around them.
 

RRG_old

Guest
When did he suffer from fatigue? Or is this an excuse for us having a terrible 2009

It was widely publicised mid to late 2009 that Mannering was suffering from fatigue and this was the main reason given for his dip in form. This was mainly put down to his consecutive games. But I can't help wonder if the amount of minutes he was playing also contributed.

I agree that he is certainly not an impact player, but we may get more out of him if he did have one spell in a game. I would aim to have him playing somewhere between 65 and 70 mins a game with the understanding that I wanted to see more out of him with ball in hand
 

daj3_old

Guest
I'm not the biggest Luck fan, but he's impressed me in 2010. I do agree that he ends up with the ball in crucial situations too often, but he doesn't look nearly as out of place with the ball in hand as he did in 2008. I'm excited to see what another off-season and increased confidence after a great season can do for him. Let's be honest, he's never going to be the kind of lock that could fill in at five-eigths for us... but a little more work on vision and distribution could see him being a useful link in the midfield. From there, chuck the odd dummy in there and Luck might even have an reasonable running game.
 

danco_old

Guest
Weather he played tonight or not the way the team played we would have lost anyway.

What you said is right on target, we were not going to beat the Titans this year. Michael Luck without him this year how many more games would we have lost. defense is the key to winning.
 

KeepingTheFaith_old

Guest
What you said is right on target, we were not going to beat the Titans this year. Michael Luck without him this year how many more games would we have lost. defense is the key to winning.

Impossible question to answer as there's too many factors to consider.

Titans are my pick for the premiership, they have the right mix of class/experience and youth in their side. Mentally they're very strong as well. Our team is relatively young and was always going to struggle to overcome them.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
Any team in the 8 would have lost that game, but try telling that to the cynics who lay the boot in as soon as the Warriors lose. What pisses me off is the number of people i've talked to who have reacted with a "theyve proven to be shit, didnt deserve to be there anyway" comments. Mostly fags who are used to watching the All Blacks/Crugayders. Then asked me what i thought of the All Blacks...and when i tell them i watched the 2 other NRL semis that night...and got more entertainment from those 2 games than you'd find in a decade of Union...look at me as if i'm completely insane.
 

dingleberry_old

Guest
Just wanted to add - the titans have the best win record this season against all of the top 8 sides - something like 63%, while warriors are worst at 20%.
Titans are big game players and the warriors choked a little against them.
I can't understand the Manu criticism too much though - sure he made some crucial mistakes but he looked like he was playing his heart out - he must have hit it up more then any of the forwards.
 

DanKokoro_old

Guest
What you said is right on target, we were not going to beat the Titans this year.

Why not? It's not like they're light years ahead of us. The first two times we played them we were up by plenty and then went to sleep. They didn't put a sleep spell on us either, we just took the foot off the peddle and paid the price.

That Titans outfit, while good, was in no way unbeatable. If we'd gotten our fair share of the penalty count then we might've found out. The fact of the matter is we weren't even given a chance to compete because we were absolutely done in the first half by some terrible referreeing.. Yes they converted their opportunities well but they should have never had the opportunities to begin with.

I heard Michael Luck and Brent Tate on Radio sport the week leading up to the game and they talked alot about not giving away penalties and how the team (and James Maloney) knew how crucial it was to not give the ref a chance to blow the whistle in these finals games. Well in my opinion we were very disciplined. It didn't stop the Ref from finding reasons to penalise us and give the Titans a piggy back ride.

Imagine if fortunes were reversed. Imagine every time we dropped the ball it was called a strip against the titans and every time they dropped us it was ruled knock on. They wouldn't have been able to get their hands on the ball and we would have won. Who do you expect would have won.

Yes i know home team advantage bs... the reffing in that game went well beyond that. Yes i keep harping on about it but it just really f**ks be off that we weren't even given a chance.

It's not like they were given penalties for us lying on the tackler. Those can be contentious but they don't hurt you as much. The penalties we conceeded (or deprived of) were all from lost ball in the tackle. Whe those go against you wrongly, not only does the opposition get an opportunity to score but YOU have been deprived of an opportunity to score. It can essentially be a 12 point swing. This is what totally ****ed us..

Done bitching about the referees but seriously.. the Titans were not unbeatable.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
They werent, but we needed shit to go our way. They're a better team than us for sure, but not light years ahead.

But when you're facing a team better than you, and theyre in good form...factors like home advantage and referee errors are just amplified. We would have had to play out of our skin to win..and we didnt. That's the way it goes. The annoying thing is i'm 75% sure that we would have won our Week 2 game...
 

ToiletDuck_old

Guest
Yeah I didn't think they were that far ahead, but they were/are definitely the better team. I see their style of play as similar to ours, but they had more quality where it counts in their 6, 7 and 9.
 

Iafeta_old

Guest
In terms of the Gold Coast "Are they better comment." I just want to make one quick point to put things in some sort of perspective.

When Greg Inglis signed with Brisbane, there was a comment that went around that Brisbane have 20 of their top 25 earning good top ups through third party payments. 20. Inglis from memory next year will be officially paid under the cap for $400K, but receive over $600K. With Lockyer's 10 year dispensation, he is apparently on the cap for about $250K. 20. That's the number. 20.

One of the considerations Manu Vatuvei's manager had in respect to him resigning with the Warriors is the fact that the Warriors were finding it tough to find ONE third party to top up Vatuvei's earnings. ONE.

In reflection, DanK is right. Badger stops taking a dump on us and there's no reason to suspect we can't win. One bad penalty on Rapira resulted in a rush of 18 points. Penalties and dodgy knock on calls are having massive influences on the games these days.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
Yeah, but we had to rise above the call. It's shit, but it happened. That's what good/great teams do - they can deal with it. It's just a lot harder to do away from home.

Look at the Roosters, they rose above being carved up, being made to look like tools, and soaking up all that offensive pressure. Quite frankly that was a cluster**** of a performance from the Tigers though, lacked the killer edge and too often looked like they were there for a romp in the park and took the win for granted. But anyway.

The Zillman try was pathetic as well and there were some limp individual performances (Lance, Kevin, Ben?). Hendog was missed. We would have to have played a lot better to jag a win.

In fact i think that was the difference this year, we didnt have that extra finals football gear that the Roosters, Titans and Dragons do. Or at least never got the chance to show it. No shame in that though, it takes a while to build up. The players should be hardened next year.
 

Iafeta_old

Guest
I feel we were playing well enough in the first 20 minutes. I don't make a point of saying one call cripples a team, but that one call... momentum killer x a zillion. I wouldn't necessarily bring it up but for the fact that it seemed to happen pretty much all season. God, the refereeing was appalling!

On the Tigers-Roosters game. Couldn't believe how poorly the Tigers played. Chris Heinington... what a mong. But then they go to extra time and decide, when a field goal is necessary, to start spreading the ball when they had no front foot ball. I can only surmise that they are very poorly coached. The try that cost them the game was a result of that, 4th tackle, 40m out, instead of hitting it up they decide off a slow play the ball to spread it to the right, and then for a backrower to try and throw a miracle 30m spiral ball back into the middle of the ruck. I said it last week when the Gold Coast, who played very poorly, beat the Tigers that the Tigers are no chance of the premiership because they don't like playing hard football, they love playing side to side, I'm sure if they could they would happily pass the ball along the fourth row of the crowd.

You're right, I never expected us to win the premiership, for that reason in that we didn't have the real killer X factor. If we didn't dive out in week one, I expected us to win in week two as the nerves that the likes of Matulino and Ta'ai suffered from should have diminished a bit, and then in week three we'd be run out. This is why Mateo intrigues me. A ball player ... his off season is crucial. I wouldn't tell him to put the cue in the rack, I'd just get him a bit fitter. It'd be nice for him to drag defenders in with his offloading so that when it goes to the edges there's space to play with.