mt.wellington
Warriors Orange Peeler
Contributor
Mr Frank White
Contributor
Hell, no. him and Cleary are carbon copies of the same boring script. selections are woeful, and just like Clearys tenure here no fucking gameplan. Neither could be described as a tactician.
I dont care Taylor trains well and is no frills, hes also no skills, and certainly isnt a defensive rock like Manners. Locke ditto.. Leaving Beastwood out is unforgivable, as is letting a guy with a broken leg play.. Muppets..
Did they think we would roll over the top of their pack? In which case theyre delusional. If they didnt, then where is the alternate plan? Did we pick a super mobile squad to stretch Australia's edges? Nope went with the Cleary / Kearney special, one out hit ups with crap kick to finish..
I dont care Taylor trains well and is no frills, hes also no skills, and certainly isnt a defensive rock like Manners. Locke ditto.. Leaving Beastwood out is unforgivable, as is letting a guy with a broken leg play.. Muppets..
Did they think we would roll over the top of their pack? In which case theyre delusional. If they didnt, then where is the alternate plan? Did we pick a super mobile squad to stretch Australia's edges? Nope went with the Cleary / Kearney special, one out hit ups with crap kick to finish..
Viking
Judging by this quote from Cleary, I'm starting to think that picking him as an assistant may have been Kearney's biggest mistake of this World Cup. So we need to wait for half this Australian team to retire before we can expect the Kiwis to have a chance? What a load of shit.
Another reason why Bellamy could be beneficial in the short term, all of the 'once-in-a-generation' players learnt their trade from him.
wallacenz
..and when they move on there will be another set of once in a generation players (the next generation).
Jay M
Contributor
Yup, because the likes of Papalii, Cherry-Evans, Cordner, Fifita, Barba etc will be such poor replacements for the existing lot... The fact that those types of players are already knocking on the door of this awesome (yet ageing) Aus squad just shows how much talent they have... and by the time they are starting in a couple of years time - they'll all have 2-4 years of origin under their belt...
Voted no on the poll. I don't think they picked the right team (Hoffman, Eastwood etc should have been included) and the game plan wasn't great. Sure the kangaroos played very well. But what did we expect? They wanted their title back, and we called them out in the haka (finger pointing)... We still should have been able to score points. Where was the composure? That game reminded me of several years back when we had a couple of world class players and the rest were making up the numbers.
mode81
What did Cleary ask or say to Sheens before the final on a radio interview? If the Kangaroos were willing to go 80 minutes full on intensity!?..something along those lines, didn't that backfire big time, they showed us the real meaning of 80 minutes of intensity, better to keep your trap shut when everybody can see you have too many weak link players in your line up.
Cleary can go away now, thanks but no thanks to you, same for Kearney, cheers for the World Cup and Four Nations but haven't seen any improvement to the team what so ever during his tenure, not down with losing time after time and the same old bs excuses, time for a new coach, new management and fresh ideas.
Cleary can go away now, thanks but no thanks to you, same for Kearney, cheers for the World Cup and Four Nations but haven't seen any improvement to the team what so ever during his tenure, not down with losing time after time and the same old bs excuses, time for a new coach, new management and fresh ideas.
mrblonde
The thing is you can't put the World Cup or the Four Nations down to Kearney - actually, TBPH you can't credit any Kiwis official involved in 2008 or 2010 with those. Bennett didn't tell the boys to throw that pass 8m forward, nor do I think he instructed Billy Slater to have a brainfade in 2008.
And that's precisely the Kiwis - and ultimately rugby league internatlonally's - problem. Since 2005 (24-0), no-one has beaten the Aussies. They've screwed up. Or officials have screwed up. Even when teams (New Zealand or England) play well the result's too much of a foregone conclusion. Nice England not letting Australia run away with it, but the win to the Australia wasn't ever really in doubt.
Not sold on Cleary as an international coach - see what develops at Penrith first.
Heck, I'd take Bluey back right now if he wanted the job. Or has Kemble learned his lesson?
And that's precisely the Kiwis - and ultimately rugby league internatlonally's - problem. Since 2005 (24-0), no-one has beaten the Aussies. They've screwed up. Or officials have screwed up. Even when teams (New Zealand or England) play well the result's too much of a foregone conclusion. Nice England not letting Australia run away with it, but the win to the Australia wasn't ever really in doubt.
Not sold on Cleary as an international coach - see what develops at Penrith first.
Heck, I'd take Bluey back right now if he wanted the job. Or has Kemble learned his lesson?
mode81
Either way you look at it their both too conservative and not bold enough for me, they both don't have the courage to step outside their structured rubbish so they both should go, you need a mix of aggression, flair, x factor, experienced muscle not same old same old predictable robotic crap , structure is all part and parcel of it no doubt but so is moving away from conservatism and trying things out of the ordinary, which these two never do.
Slash Razor
right on bro, we should have gone outside the box, if we didn't have Marshalls and a few others flair and xfactor in the 2008 WC and 4 Nations we would have got gobbled up by Australia, that's what won us the game, that's how we've always won against Australia, like you said these two guys Kearney or Cleary are to conservative, they should have thrown a spanner in the works, and tried to upset Australias plan but No its all to predictable and easy to read, I would have loved to have seen Eastwood and Inu out there, they might not have change the result but I sure reakon they would have made a better impact...
oh well in the end Australia just to experienced and well deserved victors, we do have a very talented young team that I'm sure will make us proud in the future...
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gREVUS
Long live the Rainbows and Butterflies
Contributor
the thing that concerned me most about the world cup coach was that when things didn't go right they didn't change anything. They had no option B, defn no option C. There was one point in the game against England where it was obvious they had changed their tactics to close down NZ and it was working. A word from the coach would have moved the play of the ball to the other side. In the game against Australia, Hayne got back up - ok now hes a target have every player run at him full steam, get the ball to Manu and tell him to run straight at him. Nope I don't think they even looked at that side of the pitch for another 10-15 minutes.
This lack of creativity on the fly is often focused on the players, but the coach has the best view of the game and should be creating the strategy to win it for us. So for this reason I voted no.
This lack of creativity on the fly is often focused on the players, but the coach has the best view of the game and should be creating the strategy to win it for us. So for this reason I voted no.
Tim sheens doesnt look like with get another gig in NRL anytime soon, so you'd think he's locked up australian role atleast for next year. Daly has NSW role locked up and Meninga has mortage on the queensland role.
If you look at some of the good coaches in NRL, Belamy, Hasler, Toovey, Trent Robinson, McGuire, Neil Henry...surely these guys have aspirations of leading a rep team, and right now the only one open (or atleast you'd think after the WC debacle) is the head coach role of NZ...surely its just a matter of how much you pay them to land one of these
If you look at some of the good coaches in NRL, Belamy, Hasler, Toovey, Trent Robinson, McGuire, Neil Henry...surely these guys have aspirations of leading a rep team, and right now the only one open (or atleast you'd think after the WC debacle) is the head coach role of NZ...surely its just a matter of how much you pay them to land one of these
Freddie Futler
Johnson not up to the task
The new Kiwis coach must ditch Shaun Johnson unless the Warriors No 7 has a personality transplant. Johnson wins the odd battle and loses every war. He disappears too often and his defensive softness places too much pressure on others. The Kiwis would have been more formidable with Foran at halfback and Sonny Bill Williams at pivot, no matter how crazy that sounds. Picking Johnson means the Kiwis are happy for rare wins if everything falls into place. This loser mentality has to be eradicated. NRL football is hard enough, but representative league is a brutal mind and body deal beyond a lot of players and Johnson - who plays a key position - is one of those.
Hard hitting article about recruiting Gould as Kiwi Coach.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/best-of-sport-analysis/news/article.cfm?c_id=1502180&objectid=11167037
The new Kiwis coach must ditch Shaun Johnson unless the Warriors No 7 has a personality transplant. Johnson wins the odd battle and loses every war. He disappears too often and his defensive softness places too much pressure on others. The Kiwis would have been more formidable with Foran at halfback and Sonny Bill Williams at pivot, no matter how crazy that sounds. Picking Johnson means the Kiwis are happy for rare wins if everything falls into place. This loser mentality has to be eradicated. NRL football is hard enough, but representative league is a brutal mind and body deal beyond a lot of players and Johnson - who plays a key position - is one of those.
Hard hitting article about recruiting Gould as Kiwi Coach.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/best-of-sport-analysis/news/article.cfm?c_id=1502180&objectid=11167037
Hasler would be my pick, he's gets the best out of Kiwi players. Has done so at Manly and now the Dogs.
OMG
Rattue is a Yawnion loving idiot, has he ever written something good about League- anyone that thinks Shaun Johnson was the problem in that game is an idiot too, our pack was dominated and showed little or no urgency on defence, winning the wrestle isn't a man on man thing, you can only win the wrestle when you get numbers to the tackle and effectively win the tackle and slow down the ball.
Shaun Johnson and Foran were in for a hiding from the first dropped ball from Bromwhich which set the tone for the entire game, you could say Shaun Johnson's kicking was average but IMO the chase and pressure that was being put on him was outstanding, a lack of urgency when he did get off a decent kick was also very obvious.
For mine the leadership group within the Kiwi team should own this, the Captain in particular, he isn't up to it and it's getting harder to see him ever being up to it.
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Dont agree with anythign in that article except for the "we dont need a NZ'er to be a coach" part
Phil Gould "dream" is so ridiculous - He's general manager of football at Penrith, he's not going to take up the NZ role. If NZRL approach him, it will just show that they have no idea what they doing and which direction to head in.
LOL...he talks about getting rid of johnson, but doesnt bother naming any alternatives (other than reminisce about SBW in pivot role...which in itself is ridiculous. Backup to halves incase of injury, maybe. But you go into a match with SBW as your half!!), The fact is even after 2 full seasons johnson has not reached the level everyone expected him to, but in saying that I cant come up with single name to replace him in NZ squad
I've heard David Kidwell name a few times for the NZ assistant role...I dont see what he'll being to the NZ team. For me, its more imp. to pick a shrewd tactitian than a passionate Kiwi "enforcer". The former will allow you to come up with a plan to beat australia, the latter will let you perform a passionate Haka and put on one or two big shots in the game. I'd rather pick the a combination of Craig Bellamy/Trent Robinson OR Bennett/Neil Henry OR Hasler/Toovey coach/assistant combination
Phil Gould "dream" is so ridiculous - He's general manager of football at Penrith, he's not going to take up the NZ role. If NZRL approach him, it will just show that they have no idea what they doing and which direction to head in.
LOL...he talks about getting rid of johnson, but doesnt bother naming any alternatives (other than reminisce about SBW in pivot role...which in itself is ridiculous. Backup to halves incase of injury, maybe. But you go into a match with SBW as your half!!), The fact is even after 2 full seasons johnson has not reached the level everyone expected him to, but in saying that I cant come up with single name to replace him in NZ squad
I've heard David Kidwell name a few times for the NZ assistant role...I dont see what he'll being to the NZ team. For me, its more imp. to pick a shrewd tactitian than a passionate Kiwi "enforcer". The former will allow you to come up with a plan to beat australia, the latter will let you perform a passionate Haka and put on one or two big shots in the game. I'd rather pick the a combination of Craig Bellamy/Trent Robinson OR Bennett/Neil Henry OR Hasler/Toovey coach/assistant combination
wallacenz
dunno about ackland but kidwell is worth a try. im over cleary, hopefully kearney goes and cleary doesnt get the job. hes just too conservative which many people have been saying for a while now.
Sup42
Contributor
Kidwell would be interesting.
Some of his team mates complained about his screaming at them antics on the field when they stuffed up.
He must have curbed that a lot to get himself long term assistance roles in the game.
Calling for Johnson to be sacked outright is a mistake. You can't blame that lost world cup campaign on Johnson. While I like the idea of SBW at six and nominated the same idea in one of my world cup team selections.....it was never going to happen , the conservative boys couldn't even see there way to playing SBW at center.
The forwards were out played , that made Johnson inadequacies amplified. But it also showed that a good half like Foran can't do much off bad ball either.
NZ doesn't have the depth yet to discard Johnson , and blaming one player for an across the park bad showing is no good either.
Rattue is a real hater , worse than me. That's his axe to grind....that he doesn't like flashy pants Johnson and has a job where he can take pot shots is going to get people talking...that's his job.
Johnson is probably curable , he probably needs to go to another club and play with someone he looks up too.....more importantly someone he has to listen to.
That would be why the Warriors have tried to put Tomkins and Carney around him , to polish that rough diamond or at least try before giving up.
Some of his team mates complained about his screaming at them antics on the field when they stuffed up.
He must have curbed that a lot to get himself long term assistance roles in the game.
Calling for Johnson to be sacked outright is a mistake. You can't blame that lost world cup campaign on Johnson. While I like the idea of SBW at six and nominated the same idea in one of my world cup team selections.....it was never going to happen , the conservative boys couldn't even see there way to playing SBW at center.
The forwards were out played , that made Johnson inadequacies amplified. But it also showed that a good half like Foran can't do much off bad ball either.
NZ doesn't have the depth yet to discard Johnson , and blaming one player for an across the park bad showing is no good either.
Rattue is a real hater , worse than me. That's his axe to grind....that he doesn't like flashy pants Johnson and has a job where he can take pot shots is going to get people talking...that's his job.
Johnson is probably curable , he probably needs to go to another club and play with someone he looks up too.....more importantly someone he has to listen to.
That would be why the Warriors have tried to put Tomkins and Carney around him , to polish that rough diamond or at least try before giving up.
