General Te Maire Martin

WarriorBall

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Any halves signing is influential for a club so it's worth debating TMM given the strength of the rumors to see where people sit.


 
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WarriorBall

Guest
I don't know if he's necessarily the game management half we were anticipating the club going for, maybe their options were limited in that department who knows but I don't see him bossing the side around the park that'll be left to SJ no doubt.

Regarding Hingano vs TMM from what I've seen TMM is probably the more polished of the two. I'd put That down to him coming through the Australian system which isn't a slight on Ata. It's hard to gauge exactly but he's probably quicker than Hingano in my view, I've seen him run down some very fast outside backs and seems slippery quick when he gets to the outside of a player or slices through the line if eyes aren't on him.

He's played predominantly left side coming through the grades but he's been shifted to the right partnering with Cleary at the Panthers so no issue for me with him playing left side for us.

Either way If we go with Hingano or we sign TMM SJ will need to step up.
 

Stalefish540

CovidWarriors-20
Contributor
May 13, 2017
1,923
Mt. Smart
Comes down to lack of options really. TMM and Ata are neither here nor there. Ata has stronger defence and is a game manager, but I feel is still abit green and was afraid of SJ's stature to overcall him early in the year. He was given the reigns in the Tonga game over the weekend and did a solid job leading them round the park. TMM is a show and go player and is a perfect foil for a manager like Cleary. So Kearney is going against everything hes learnt SJ needs to thrive since Forans inclusion. But TMM upside is he can create genuine opportunities with his speed and pass selection.

I'm on the fence as to who is the better option, only due to Ata still being 19.

Can't see him going to Storm though as they have a young 7 in Brodie Croft who is on par with Ata if not better.
 

AlexM

1st Grade Fringe
Feb 19, 2017
1,452
SJ and TMM had about 30 minutes or less together in the four nations v Scotland. I remember they looked pretty good together .. hard to tell though
 

RiceOwl

1st Grade Fringe
Mar 28, 2015
306
At this stage, I would take TMM over Ata but only just. I do rate Ata but think TMM is a bit further along in development.

As others have mentioned, the fact that TMM has come through the Aus system will be of benefit. Also he may not be this Foran-like game manager so to speak, but lets be honest here there are very few players out there that are, hence the price tag for those players. From what I have seen he does take the line on and draw defenders, and can make clutch decisions when a game is on the line. His winning performance on debut when he slotted the winning drop goal to me shows he has the confidence and ability to win a game and step up at the death.

The other positives are that he wont command a 1mill type pay packet meaning we can spend more of our cap on a much needed forward pack, and that at 21 time is on his side to continue to develop.

My feeling is that if they are both nurtured well they will both make a big impact at first grade in the coming years and we must have one of these two.

But ultimately picking up TMM would be a good decision in my mind.
 

snake77

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 12, 2013
8,022
I don't know if he's necessarily the game management half we were anticipating the club going for, maybe their options were limited in that department who knows but I don't see him bossing the side around the park that'll be left to SJ no doubt.
You are probably right about the options being limited. Most of the options either are unlikely to come here or may have another downside or that magic player probably isn't available.

Hodgkinson maybe if his knee wasn't shot would have been worth a look as he could guide a side around the field, experienced, goal kicker. A few weeks ago one NRL 360 there was discussion on how the Knights should deal with him seeing as he is most likely out of favour or his body is no longer up to it.

We get a lot of talk of signing another Steve Price or Kevin Campion or a half with specific qualities sometimes those player we had previously signed were a case of circumstance in coming here or available at the time.

Martin probably isn't ideal as an experienced half would have been better. Waiting for Foran may have left things to late and missed out or the ideal players won't come to NZ.
 
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Panther

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 13, 2016
257
Until this year Warrior halves seem to have almost played exclusively on opposite sides of the field. When a steady half was used with Johnson it just meant one side of the paddock offered steady/little attack and all the attacking responsibility fell on Johnson's side. The great thing this year, has actually been seeing Johnson work with Foran. Does TMM work alongside Cleary or opposite sides?
Our halves also seem to distribute or run set plays, it would be awesome to see the spine players look to support and start to run onto offloads more often like Jones/Hohaia/Webb/McKinnon.
 

jonno

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 13, 2014
9,804
TMM (Age 21), 12 FG Games

4 Tries, 1 Match winning Field Goal, 4 Try Assists, 6 Line Breaks, 5 Offloads, 31 Tackle Breaks, 12 Errors.

Hingano (Age 20) 5 FG Games

0 Tries, 2 Try Assists, 2 Line Breaks, 1 Offload, 0 Tackle Breaks, 4 Errors.

Hingano is too young and too inexperienced to be our first choice half next year. If Foz and SJ stay fit, he'll get zero First Grade game time this year as well.

TMM could possibly be ready. And if he's not he's closer than Hingano.

Either way Johnson is going to be our first receiver, probably slotting straight into where Foran currently plays in the structured moves, with a young running half taking over SJ's roving role. That's the thinking I see playing out if TMM is signed.
 
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Tim burgess

1st Grade Fringe
May 20, 2012
1,131
If you think about it their is a lack of quality 6 or 7 available. Hence the options are limited in terms of potential replacements for Foran.

Given TMM relative in experience either Lino or Hingano needs to be resigned.

Unless both will be leaving a the Warriors sign a player like Mitch Cornish as a replacement
 

Ever Hopeful

1st Grade Fringe
Contributor
Feb 24, 2013
1,997
I'd be happy with either if we have forwards that put us on the front foot next year.

If not, then neither are a good option for me.

You'd have to think that Ata is asking for too much coin for the Warriors to be looking for halves that are only a slight improvement. I reckon Ata would be better off setting his market value low for a couple of years, allowing the Warriors to buy an extra forward and keep him as the incumbent for 2017.

He needs FG experience for his value to rise.

What do people here know about TMM's defence. I have watched him in half a dozen games and he hasn't stood out for bad misses, but I don't know him that well. If Hingano has better defence, I'd rather have him...that is how much I value defence at the moment
 
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Sledge

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 10, 2016
1,754
I don't think he's played that well today, couple of poor kicks on the last......
 

Crusader26

1st Grade Fringe
Oct 2, 2016
113
Does anyone know why Penrith are happy to let him go? Are they confident of signing Cronk or someone like Dugan for fullback and switching Moylan to 6? Or has something else gone down?
 

Jordan G

Guest
There's been rumours of off field extra curricular activity, but I haven't seen any substance to them. In all likelihood, Penrith just realised that they have issues in the team that a kid with a dozen first grade games won't fix while he's still learning himself and have started looking for other options.
 

Mr Brownstone

1st Grade Fringe
Nov 9, 2014
2,262
Does anyone know why Penrith are happy to let him go? Are they confident of signing Cronk or someone like Dugan for fullback and switching Moylan to 6? Or has something else gone down?
Word on the Panthers forum apparently is that he shagged a teammates girlfriend. That aside, I'm really struggling to understand this signing. Further confirmation that the powers that be at the Warriors have no idea?
 

Defence

Warriors 1st Grader
May 9, 2012
5,145
My mate coached te Marie so I texted him to see what he thought and his reply was-
"Awesome pick up but same player as johnson. He'll love being home."
I replied- better than Ata?
Him- "easily"

Take from that what U will.
Here's a bit of a comparison between the the two this year- small sample size- I think tmm has played 6 first grade games and Ata 4?
Anyway it's averages per game.

IMG_6398.jpg
 

Mr Brownstone

1st Grade Fringe
Nov 9, 2014
2,262
My mate coached te Marie so I texted him to see what he thought and his reply was-
"Awesome pick up but same player as johnson. He'll love being home."
I replied- better than Ata?
Him- "easily"

Take from that what U will.
Here's a bit of a comparison between the the two this year- small sample size- I think tmm has played 6 first grade games and Ata 4?
Anyway it's averages per game.

View attachment 23080
But that's my biggest issue as well - my best mate is a Panthers fan and has seen more of him play than I have. Reckons TMM and SJ are way too similar. I'm just not getting the whole recruitment strategy. Seems too opportunistic and lacking genuine strategy.
 
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kos

1st Grade Fringe
Mar 16, 2013
509
Comes down to lack of options really. TMM and Ata are neither here nor there. Ata has stronger defence and is a game manager, but I feel is still abit green and was afraid of SJ's stature to overcall him early in the year. He was given the reigns in the Tonga game over the weekend and did a solid job leading them round the park. TMM is a show and go player and is a perfect foil for a manager like Cleary. So Kearney is going against everything hes learnt SJ needs to thrive since Forans inclusion. But TMM upside is he can create genuine opportunities with his speed and pass selection.

I'm on the fence as to who is the better option, only due to Ata still being 19.

Can't see him going to Storm though as they have a young 7 in Brodie Croft who is on par with Ata if not better.
The answer is 6 Sj 7 Mason Lino.
Lino is a talker organiser game manager and outplayed tmm in the reserves game. Sj is a natural 6.
 
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eudebrito

|-|
Contributor
May 21, 2013
3,437
Still can’t make up my mind on this, on the one hand if he’s made himself unwelcome at Penrith why not scoop him up. Better than going for a Robson type. Even if he dosen't get out of reserve grade won't be costing much.

On the other hand if he’s a just a flashy below par version of Johnson, then what is the point.
 

TheCool

1st Grade Fringe
Jul 18, 2013
802
My mate coached te Marie so I texted him to see what he thought and his reply was-
"Awesome pick up but same player as Johnson. He'll love being home."
I replied- better than Ata?
Him- "easily"
Not buying it. At the end of the day, TMM doesn't have the physicality thats required to play NRL week in week out, Anthony Griffin even said it himself. Playing with SJ is a disaster waiting to happen, we complain about Johnson's propensity to drift in and out of games and his terrible short kicking game, well TMM echoes these same weaknesses.

When TMM was Ata's age he was playing NYC. Ata is well past that, he's played two full seasons in ISP, made his NRL debut and made his international debut. People only wanting TMM over Ata because he's come through the Aussie development system is a joke, Ata couldn't have had a better development if the club tried.
2014: Played full season of NYC as a 17 year old.
2015: Played full season of ISP as an 18 year old then went back to NYC for the finals and carved up.
2016: Played full season of ISP, captained Junior Kiwis and made his NRL debut at 19 years old.
2017: More NRL and ISP while still eligible for NYC. All of this while playing only one position (unlike Tui).
That's a pretty flawless development path if you ask me and also almost unprecedented at this club as most players either go straight from NYC to NRL which is hugely detrimental IMO or go from Bartercard cup to NRL before NYC was around. TMM went straight from NYC to NRL and its so obvious that he is struggling with the physicality of this level.