General Religious Discussion Thread

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BiggerD

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Mod - Formerly the Islam in NZ thread

i live here in Sydney Australia.

Each day there are Shootings amongst muslims

last night which pissed me off, a 13 year old girl was shot in the back by a Muslim gang..

Theses Islamist groupers , im not calling them Bikies, athough media does, call em Bikes
just piss me off

As such other groups , who love their Bikes...like Nortons , Harley Ds and Triumphs
are now being being set upon by state laws etc.
 
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¿N. ig-mah¿

¿N. ig-mah¿

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I don't think NZ is exposed to quite the same level of organised gangs and extremist groups as Australia. No doubt we will have our share, but nowhere near to the degree of Oz.
 
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mrblonde

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Rowan Atkinson (The Devil): "Christians? Ah, look, yes...I'm afraid that the Jews were right."

Although his best line:
"Americans! Are you here? Yes..Well...It appears God had a bit of a fracas with the Founding Fathers and damned the entire lot of you in perpetuity."
 
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BiggerD

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Jehovahs Witness, Mormons, Hippies...
Lol in Sydney you had Muslim Riots in Central Sydney

The P/C brigade came out gettting the off there offence... (a Marginallised group).

I am so sick of the PC Brigade who imported so many Muslim refugees from Iran , Pakistan & Afghanis
but its the Lebaneeese causing troubles here in Sydney

Heck..Some Australian Islamists have gone to Syria to fight Assad
One Aussie had a suicide bomb in Syria..

All I say NZ..My Birthplace..My Whanau

Be Careful
 
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¿N. ig-mah¿

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Lol in Sydney you had Muslim Riots in Central Sydney

The P/C brigade came out gettting the off there offence... (a Marginallised group).

I am so sick of the PC Brigade who imported so many Muslim refugees from Iran , Pakistan & Afghanis
but its the Lebaneeese causing troubles here in Sydney

Heck..Some Australian Islamists have gone to Syria to fight Assad
One Aussie had a suicide bomb in Syria..

All I say NZ..My Birthplace..My Whanau

Be Careful
Perhaps I am missing something here, but hasn't Aussie had to put up with race wars between damned near every nationality, especially in Sydney? Perhaps I am out of touch, but it seems like you are just blaming Muslims for every wrong. For a start, an extremist isn't really a true Muslim, and secondly, you are ignoring all of the other races/cultures/groups who have caused these type of issues. Bikies and drug gangs have ruled the roost in Aussie for many years, with their wars that have dragged so many innocent people into the carnage. And many different cultures have clashed in race riots. But you are putting it all on just one group.

By the way, I am not pro-Muslim, but I am also not anti-Muslim.
 
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Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

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Lol in Sydney you had Muslim Riots in Central Sydney

The P/C brigade came out gettting the off there offence... (a Marginallised group).

I am so sick of the PC Brigade who imported so many Muslim refugees from Iran , Pakistan & Afghanis
but its the Lebaneeese causing troubles here in Sydney

Heck..Some Australian Islamists have gone to Syria to fight Assad
One Aussie had a suicide bomb in Syria..

All I say NZ..My Birthplace..My Whanau

Be Careful
You chose to live there, being an immigrant yourself.
 
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mt.wellington

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What cracks me up and pisses me off in equal measure are those Muslims/Islamists that migrate to other countries (Australia, America, England, etc) because their countries are busy killing themselves and then proceed to denounce the evil ways of their new host countries...
 
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Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

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Perhaps I am missing something here, but hasn't Aussie had to put up with race wars between damned near every nationality, especially in Sydney? Perhaps I am out of touch, but it seems like you are just blaming Muslims for every wrong. For a start, an extremist isn't really a true Muslim, and secondly, you are ignoring all of the other races/cultures/groups who have caused these type of issues. Bikies and drug gangs have ruled the roost in Aussie for many years, with their wars that have dragged so many innocent people into the carnage. And many different cultures have clashed in race riots. But you are putting it all on just one group.

By the way, I am not pro-Muslim, but I am also not anti-Muslim.


I am anti-religion per se.

Anyone who believes that a higher power exists and decides who gets cancer etc must be an idiot by definition, and that includes Christians.
 
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Buck777

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I don't think NZ is exposed to quite the same level of organised gangs and extremist groups as Australia. No doubt we will have our share, but nowhere near to the degree of Oz.
This is true. But NZ has a lot of 'sleeper cells'. Here's a story that never got into the headlines. Just prior to the Sydney Olympics Police were called to a 'disturbance' at an address in suburban Mt Albert in Auckland. They went inside the 50's styled brick and tile house that seemed to have a number of Muslim occupants. On entering the lounge the whole wall ( 10 meters by 4 meters ) was just one ariel shot of the Sydney Nuclear power plant, with itemised titles off all entries. There was no doubt that there was a plan to attack the plant during the Olympics. The Aussue 'authorities' flew in and were at the mt Albert house within 5 hours and were able to bring down the syndicate that had links all over the Muslim world - but sleepy Mt Albert was the HQ. We are almost living in a borderless world. Most of the Muslim attacks on the UK are organised by English born Muslims. Very hard to find those who have been radicalised.
 
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shuffle

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I am anti-religion per se.

Anyone who believes that a higher power exists and decides who gets cancer etc must be an idiot by definition, and that includes Christians.
Just wonder what life could be like if there was no religion. People could have 2 hours to spare on Sundays.
 
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Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

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What cracks me up and pisses me off in equal measure are those Muslims/Islamists that migrate to other countries (Australia, America, England, etc) because their countries are busy killing themselves and then proceed to denounce the evil ways of their new host countries...
Freedom of speech and religious tolerance are difficult issues when you are dealing with hate.

Its the off-season - bring on the huge arguments about religion, immigration, politics and rugby union!
 
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mt.wellington

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Freedom of speech and religious tolerance are difficult issues when you are dealing with hate.

Its the off-season - bring on the huge arguments about religion, immigration, politics and rugby union!
Thats better. Freedom.

Religion is the bane of all humanity. Doesnt matter what religion it is. They all preach discrimination to some extent...
 
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Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

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Thats better. Freedom.

Religion is the bane of all humanity. Doesnt matter what religion it is. They all preach discrimination to some extent...
If I said that I believe that a little man who lives in the bin created the universe and decides who lives, who dies and who will win the Super Bowl I'd be committed.

However, if I say that he lives in the clouds and that its my faith then everybody has to not only respect that, but cannot legally discriminate against me of the basis that I am quite obviously fucking nuts..
 
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drunk_monk

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If I said that I believe that a little man who lives in the bin created the universe and decides who lives, who dies and who will win the Super Bowl I'd be committed.

However, if I say that he lives in the clouds and that its my faith then everybody has to not only respect that, but cannot legally discriminate against me of the basis that I am quite obviously fucking nuts..
Well people live in the sky, and people don't live in bins. So yeah you'd have to be crazy to suggest there was a little man in a bin as its clearly crazy.
 
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Stone

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TBF there's a fairly substantial difference between fundamentalist religious zealots & your more garden variety religious types

IMO though it's all still essentially the most cunningly effective & blatantly nefarious method of mass mind control that has ever been imposed upon humanity

I studied this shit to death in Uni & a lot of my work has been & currently is actually based around writing about this stuff

My initial WTF moment came as a young kid when I actually became aware of some of my family members forking out hand over fist to the ministers (who lived far away from South Aucks in flash houses & drove brand new beamers & mercs) at their local churches, but meanwhile some of my whanau had no extra money to buy the most basic necessities of life such as clothes, food, electricity & in some cases even regular accommodation

But the real clincher for me came in Uni when I first found out just how cunningly devious & utterly nefarious this scam really is

According to the basic tenets of psychology, the human mind is essentially hard-wired to close certain open-ended psychological loops, the most common & widely spread version of this being the human primordial fear of our own mortality

Some of us can deal with this fear without having to resort to psychological phantasms, but for most human beings the fear of the death of self or the death of our egos is simply too much to mentally process & this makes people extremely mentally vulnerable & far more susceptible to snake oil salesmen offering a magical afterlife where not just your own sense of self or ego lives on in a state of blissfull eternity but so does that of all your loved ones

In that sense, it is the greatest con job with the greatest success rate to have ever existed, because people who need desperately need to close that psychological loop & can't deal with the fact that they or more aptly their egos may one day simply cease to exist will do almost anything to achieve that sense of peace of mind that comes from being able to close that loop

A lot of people give Islam a lot of shit because of some the more extremist elements of what we see or read about being done by a relatively small group in their ancient archaic religion & to a certain extent rightly so IMO, but one of the most nefariously driven financially effective religions currently being widely practiced all around the western world is also one of the most recent ... Scientology

For those who don't know, Scientology was founded in the early 1950's by L. Ron Hubbard who based his so-called "religion" on a book he previously wrote called Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health which was essentially Hubbard's own attempt to self-diagnose & self regulate his own well-documented mental illnesses, now as strange as that may initially seem what is even more of an obvious red flag is that L. Ron Hubbard was also a very prolific author of predominantly fictional work including but not limited to works of science fiction & fantasy

How Scientology "works" in a nutshell is that they believe all humans are actually separate immortal beings called thetan that have chosen to reside in human bodies, this thetan essentially holds the key to eternal life having previously sometimes lived through thousands of lifetimes, but most thetan have become corrupted over time & have forgotten their previous lives thereby also forgetting the inner key to immortality

Scientology proposes to have unlocked the secret to uncorrupting these inner thetan through a process they call auditing, but here's the real nefarious part, the process is essentially a long series of these so-called audits that you have to pay more & more money for each time you progress deeper into the process & if you decide to quit on the "church" before you have completed the process you are then labelled as a "suppressive person" & will be subsequently cut off from all friends & family members who remain Scientologists & if you dare to try & openly criticize the "church" you will then be considered an "enemy" & the "church" will then implement a process they label as "Fair Game" which essentially is a process they will use to "punish" or silence their self-perceived "enemies" by "any & all means necessary"

Now when you look at the history of religion & how ancient it's main three forms of Judaism, Islam & Christianity are then IMO it's kind of understandable that ancient peoples looked to a more mystical type realm to explain the issues they had no real sufficient scientific reasoning to understand eg: natural catastrophe and or disease being "Gods Wrath", the uncertainty of death "Gods Test of Faith" etc & it's also understandable how these ancient religions may have become ingrained in most societies, even as just a custom or social habit developed over millennia

But, the fact that Scientology was not only founded as relatively recently as the 1950's by a well-known science fiction / fantasy author with a history of mental illness but also continues to gain more & more people & financially flourish even today (it's estimated that Scientology has a net worth of well in excess of a billion dollars thanks to it's "donators" & from being able to exploit religious tax breaks) shows just how desperate most people crave, even in these modern times, an all knowing all powerful father-type figure who can magically grant them eternal life even after death thus completing the psychological loop that was previously still open but is now essentially closed

So in conclusion, religion is nothing more than a nefarious method of profit driven control that preys upon the most primordial of human fears ... death

Anyway, sorry for the big rant, I'm actually currently writing a piece on this stuff so I'm essentially cheating as I will be cutting & pasting a pretty substantial portion of this post into my article lol, the old two birds with one stone method ... shit ... no pun intended lol
 
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Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

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TBF there's a fairly substantial difference between fundamentalist religious zealots & your more garden variety religious types

IMO though it's all still essentially the most cunningly effective & blatantly nefarious method of mass mind control that has ever been imposed upon humanity

I studied this shit to death in Uni & a lot of my work has been & currently is actually based around writing about this stuff

My initial WTF moment came as a young kid when I actually became aware of some of my family members forking out hand over fist to the ministers (who lived far away from South Aucks in flash houses & drove brand new beamers & mercs) at their local churches, but meanwhile they had no extra money to buy the most basic necessities of life such as clothes, food, electricity & in some cases even regular accommodation

But the real clincher for me came in Uni when I first found out just how cunningly devious & utterly nefarious this scam really is

According to the basic tenets of psychology, the human mind is essentially hard-wired to close certain open-ended psychological loops & the most common & widely spread version of this being the human primordial fear of our own mortality

Some of us can deal with this fear without having to resort to psychological phantasms, but for most human beings the fear of the death of self or the death of our egos is simply too much to mentally process & this makes people extremely mentally vulnerable & far more susceptible to snake oil salesmen offering a magical afterlife where not just your own sense of self or ego lives on in a state of blissfull eternity but so does that of all your loved ones

In that sense, it is the greatest con job with the greatest success rate to have ever existed, because people who need desperately need to close that psychological loop & can't deal with the fact that they or more aptly their egos may one day simply cease to exist will do almost anything to achieve that sense of peace of mind that comes from being able to close that loop

A lot of people give Islam a lot of shit because of some the more extremist elements of what we see or read about being done by a relatively small group in their ancient archaic religion & to a certain extent rightly so IMO, but one of the most nefariously driven financially effective religions currently being widely practiced all around the western world is also one of the most recent ... Scientology

For those who don't know, Scientology was founded in the early 1950's by L. Ron Hubbard who based his so-called "religion" on a book he previously wrote called Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health which was essentially Hubbard's own attempt to self-diagnose & self regulate his own well-documented mental illnesses, now as strange as that may initially seem what is even more of an obvious red flag is that L. Ron Hubbard was also a very prolific author of predominantly fictional work including but not limited to works of science fiction & fantasy

How Scientology "works" in a nutshell is that they believe all humans are actually separate immortal beings called thetan that have chosen to reside in human bodies, this thetan essentially holds the key to eternal life having previously sometimes lived through thousands of lifetimes, but most thetan have become corrupted over time & have forgotten their previous lives thereby also forgetting the inner key to immortality

Scientology proposes to have unlocked the secret to uncorrupting these inner thetan through a process they call auditing, but here's the real nefarious part, the process is essentially a long series of these so-called audits that you have to pay more & more money for each time you progress deeper into the process & if you decide to quit on the "church" before you have completed the process you are then labelled as a "suppressive person" & will be subsequently cut off from all friends & family members who remain Scientologists & if you dare to try & openly criticize the "church" you will then be considered an "enemy" & the "church" will then implement a process they label as "Fair Game" which essentially is a process they will use to "punish" or silence "enemies" by "any & all means neccesary"

Now when you look at the history of religion & how ancient it's main three forms of Judaism, Islam & Christianity are then IMO it's kind of understandable that ancient peoples looked to a more mystical type realm to explain the issues they had no sufficient scientific reasoning to understand eg: natural catastrophe and or disease being "Gods Wrath", the uncertainty of death "Gods Test of Faith" etc & it's also understandable how these ancient religions have become ingrained in most societies, even as just a custom or social habit developed over the millennia

But, the fact that Scientology was not only founded as relatively recently as the 1950's by a well-known science fiction / fantasy author with a history of mental illness but also continues to gain more & more people & financially flourish even today (it's estimated that Scientology has a net worth of in excess of a billion dollars thanks to it's "donators" & from being able to exploit religious tax breaks) shows just how desperate most people crave, even in these modern times, an all knowing all powerful father-type figure who can magically grant them eternal life even after death thus completing the psychological loop that they was previously still open but is afterwards closed

So in conclusion, religion is nothing more than a nefarious method of profit driven control that preys upon the most primordial of human fears ... death

Anyway, sorry for the big rant, I'm actually currently writing a piece on this stuff so I'm essentially cheating as I will be cutting & pasting a pretty substantial portion of this post into my article lol, the old two birds with one stone method ... shit ... no pun intended lol
As Ricky Gervais said, the afterlife is going to be very much like the 13.8b years of before your life.
 
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Stone

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As Ricky Gervais said, the afterlife is going to be very much like the 13.8b years of before your life.
Yeah brother I get that & I also agree to a certain extent

But overall, as an agnostic my only real belief on what happens after death is that none of really know anything for certain

It could be a fade to black eternal sleep, it could be a return to the light or source, it could be reincarnation, shit according to some recent scientific research this whole realm of existence as far as we know it could be nothing more than a giant infinite simulation

Who really knows aye ??? ... not me ... that much I do know for certain
 
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