Player Roger Tuivasa-Sheck

[John Nick]

I am too new to league to have any sage observations about whether Roger is best suited to centre and if so left centre vs right centre, or if he should go to the wing. I do have a question though = what does a good centre look like skill set wise and how close is Roger to matching that ?
Who are and who have have been the great warriors centres and how close is Roger to their skill set?

The best centre I have ever seen and played against was also a Roger.
Played for Ponsonby before the Warriors were born.
Roger Bailey was a great player and if you were a winger outside him you would normally be the highest try scorer for the year. Great defense and awesome on attack.

The best centres for the Warriors imo were.
Defencively:Brent Tate who was a genius at setting the defense line and barked orders to set the line.

Attacking: Toopi by a long way.
Ropati a good second

 

[WahsUltras]

A bit of a deep dive into how RTS compare's to other top centers in the league through 7 rounds:
2nd in run meters to Lomax who has predominantly played on the wing @186m
Similar tackle efficiency to Joey Manu and Kotoni Staggs @83%, and higher than Critta and Holmes, while also averaging more tackles per game overall.
Averages 1 error per game which is less than Tago, Holmes and Manu.

So far through 7 rounds, RTS blows Pompey out of the park in the majority of stat categories from last season.

Could the problem be a lack of confidence and connection with his outside man (Montoya) which is seeing our left edge struggle to fire? Because statistically, RTS is up there with the top 5 centers in the league.

 

[BangBro's (still banging)]

Ultimately the contingency plan after round 12 if it is not working out is to put him on Montoya's wing.
A back three of DWZ, CNK, RTS is elite.

Still drop Montoya for pompey on the wing.

 

[MrFrankWhite]

A bit of a deep dive into how RTS compare's to other top centers in the league through 7 rounds:
2nd in run meters to Lomax who has predominantly played on the wing @186m
Similar tackle efficiency to Joey Manu and Kotoni Staggs @83%, and higher than Critta and Holmes, while also averaging more tackles per game overall.
Averages 1 error per game which is less than Tago, Holmes and Manu.

So far through 7 rounds, RTS blows Pompey out of the park in the majority of stat categories from last season.

Could the problem be a lack of confidence and connection with his outside man (Montoya) which is seeing our left edge struggle to fire? Because statistically, RTS is up there with the top 5 centers in the league.

Thats good to point out, makes me reflect

 

[BabylonPink]

Having our starting forwards play 50-60+ minutes is what's fucking us up.
Sheck will look better when he's got a better platform.
The fact he is RTS bring more scrutiny. The fact Pompey was lambasted last year for being average says a lot when sheck is better but not winning us games.

 

[Makasene]

Still drop Montoya for pompey on the wing.

I'd like to see it.

Montoya is all effort but just seems off the pace.

I can't think of a single feature about his game that demands his inclusion.

Problem with only having effort as an asset is that in a better team, you don't need the effort guy as much. Especially on the wing, you want a guy that might do something.

Montoya has had some good games at centre but can't see them moving Rog.

 

[ShaunJohnson7]

A bit of a deep dive into how RTS compare's to other top centers in the league through 7 rounds:
2nd in run meters to Lomax who has predominantly played on the wing @186m
Similar tackle efficiency to Joey Manu and Kotoni Staggs @83%, and higher than Critta and Holmes, while also averaging more tackles per game overall.
Averages 1 error per game which is less than Tago, Holmes and Manu.

So far through 7 rounds, RTS blows Pompey out of the park in the majority of stat categories from last season.

Could the problem be a lack of confidence and connection with his outside man (Montoya) which is seeing our left edge struggle to fire? Because statistically, RTS is up there with the top 5 centers in the league.

Run metres for RTS have also been helped by 1.5 games at fullback and 1 at wing to be fair. But I want to see him continue at centre, he needs time.

I really do hope he can work on getting the ball to his outside man more but at the same time hasn't been given a lot of quality ball himself. Shifting around positions has done him no favours in getting familiar with a new position either.

 

[Boats n Hoes]

Tbh im not sure why Roger seems to be bearing the brunt for the lack of link play on the left.

Got to look at how he's receiving the ball. My initial concern with Roger at centre was he would only get the ball from either hit ups, or they would throw it to him when nothing else was on......and unfortunately the latter seems to be the only way he does get it when it goes through the hands.

Where's the shape? Where's the lead runner holding the D from drifting straight out? Or even 2 lead runners with Roger being the 2nd the same as we see Berry often used on the right (and tbh why wouldnt u use Roger in that capacity as he's a far more explosive and stronger runner than Rocco). Where's the fullback sweeping around providing a hint of a decoy in which the D may over read? The way he's receiving it with no movement off the ball around him leaves his choices limited to either trying to beat his man on the outside (which if he cant just runs his winger out of space) or that left foot step to beat his player on the inside (which even if successful is covered by the defence drifting across). Feeding his winger was always going to be a work on for Rog, but with no shapes, decoys, movement off the ball, theres no overlaps or space created, most from what ive seen when he's been criticised for not passing to his winger, their covered anyway, probably get bundled out into touch.

We know that he's special in that he can beat players 1 on 1 either with footwork or busting the line, but for christ sake, he'd be even more dangerous with a little bit more space that some shape would throw up. Surely that's on the left edge halfback to organize that. Against the Dragons there was none whatsoever, the few times they did get it, it was just straight hands.......worryingly enough the only time their seems to be a hint of shape is when SJ sweeps round which seems to start everyone moving.

Connection and timing on that left was always going to be a work in progress, especially when Metcalf was running that edge..... but damn it seems to be totally non existant of late....and that's not just on Rog.

 

[Inruin]

Tbh im not sure why Roger seems to be bearing the brunt for the lack of link play on the left.

Got to look at how he's receiving the ball. My initial concern with Roger at centre was he would only get the ball from either hit ups, or they would throw it to him when nothing else was on......and unfortunately the latter seems to be the only way he does get it when it goes through the hands.

Where's the shape? Where's the lead runner holding the D from drifting straight out? Or even 2 lead runners with Roger being the 2nd the same as we see Berry often used on the right (and tbh why wouldnt u use Roger in that capacity as he's a far more explosive and stronger runner than Rocco). Where's the fullback sweeping around providing a hint of a decoy in which the D may over read? The way he's receiving it with no movement off the ball around him leaves his choices limited to either trying to beat his man on the outside (which if he cant just runs his winger out of space) or that left foot step to beat his player on the inside (which even if successful is covered by the defence drifting across). Feeding his winger was always going to be a work on for Rog, but with no shapes, decoys, movement off the ball, theres no overlaps or space created, most from what ive seen when he's been criticised for not passing to his winger, their covered anyway, probably get bundled out into touch.

We know that he's special in that he can beat players 1 on 1 either with footwork or busting the line, but for christ sake, he'd be even more dangerous with a little bit more space that some shape would throw up. Surely that's on the left edge halfback to organize that. Against the Dragons there was none whatsoever, the few times they did get it, it was just straight hands.......worryingly enough the only time their seems to be a hint of shape is when SJ sweeps round which seems to start everyone moving.

Connection and timing on that left was always going to be a work in progress, especially when Metcalf was running that edge..... but damn it seems to be totally non existant of late....and that's not just on Rog.

Agree, be interesting to see if AW changes anything in terms of tactics there. Our left edge last season had the lowest % of tries created in the league and we are very similar again this season so far. We are very much a right side dominant attacking team including CNK hitting that edge. Against St George, both edges were being nullified fairly easily on the weekend. Two back rowers not doing much on the attacking side and a lack of input from not using our bench doesn't help. Against South's we looked much better and showed some very good signs (that was with Pompey at centre though)

I think many underestimate that link play that Walker does for us. Looking forward to him being named. Titans game will be interesting. They are a fast team across the park. Our attack and defence need to be switched on or it could be a messy result for us.

 

[Beastmode]

A bit of a deep dive into how RTS compare's to other top centers in the league through 7 rounds:
2nd in run meters to Lomax who has predominantly played on the wing @186m
Similar tackle efficiency to Joey Manu and Kotoni Staggs @83%, and higher than Critta and Holmes, while also averaging more tackles per game overall.
Averages 1 error per game which is less than Tago, Holmes and Manu.

So far through 7 rounds, RTS blows Pompey out of the park in the majority of stat categories from last season.

Could the problem be a lack of confidence and connection with his outside man (Montoya) which is seeing our left edge struggle to fire? Because statistically, RTS is up there with the top 5 centers in the league.

I guess the dumb brain farts is masking the good wok….

Tbh im not sure why Roger seems to be bearing the brunt for the lack of link play on the left.

Got to look at how he's receiving the ball. My initial concern with Roger at centre was he would only get the ball from either hit ups, or they would throw it to him when nothing else was on......and unfortunately the latter seems to be the only way he does get it when it goes through the hands.

Where's the shape? Where's the lead runner holding the D from drifting straight out? Or even 2 lead runners with Roger being the 2nd the same as we see Berry often used on the right (and tbh why wouldnt u use Roger in that capacity as he's a far more explosive and stronger runner than Rocco). Where's the fullback sweeping around providing a hint of a decoy in which the D may over read? The way he's receiving it with no movement off the ball around him leaves his choices limited to either trying to beat his man on the outside (which if he cant just runs his winger out of space) or that left foot step to beat his player on the inside (which even if successful is covered by the defence drifting across). Feeding his winger was always going to be a work on for Rog, but with no shapes, decoys, movement off the ball, theres no overlaps or space created, most from what ive seen when he's been criticised for not passing to his winger, their covered anyway, probably get bundled out into touch.

We know that he's special in that he can beat players 1 on 1 either with footwork or busting the line, but for christ sake, he'd be even more dangerous with a little bit more space that some shape would throw up. Surely that's on the left edge halfback to organize that. Against the Dragons there was none whatsoever, the few times they did get it, it was just straight hands.......worryingly enough the only time their seems to be a hint of shape is when SJ sweeps round which seems to start everyone moving.

Connection and timing on that left was always going to be a work in progress, especially when Metcalf was running that edge..... but damn it seems to be totally non existant of late....and that's not just on Rog.

The secret sauce is on the right.
That is SJ’s favoured side
All paths lead to the right

A right side attack with SJ, Marata, RTS, CNK and DZW sweeping in would be pretty dam good …

Don’t know why the left side hardly functions properly … I thought it was all Pompey now not so sure…

 

[run_it_str8_again]

Roger to the Knights for a prop? And two roast pork and crackling sandwiches?

 

[run_it_str8_again]

I guess the dumb brain farts is masking the good wok….



The secret sauce is on the right.
That is SJ’s favoured side
All paths lead to the right

A right side attack with SJ, Marata, RTS, CNK and DZW sweeping in would be pretty dam good …

Don’t know why the left side hardly functions properly … I thought it was all Pompey now not so sure…

Roger would benefit from consistency.

Re SJ on the right. He can run the left side attack as well. Remember Lewis Brown's try against the storm? SJ on the left.

 

[Stalefish540]

Tbh im not sure why Roger seems to be bearing the brunt for the lack of link play on the left.

Got to look at how he's receiving the ball. My initial concern with Roger at centre was he would only get the ball from either hit ups, or they would throw it to him when nothing else was on......and unfortunately the latter seems to be the only way he does get it when it goes through the hands.

Where's the shape? Where's the lead runner holding the D from drifting straight out? Or even 2 lead runners with Roger being the 2nd the same as we see Berry often used on the right (and tbh why wouldnt u use Roger in that capacity as he's a far more explosive and stronger runner than Rocco). Where's the fullback sweeping around providing a hint of a decoy in which the D may over read? The way he's receiving it with no movement off the ball around him leaves his choices limited to either trying to beat his man on the outside (which if he cant just runs his winger out of space) or that left foot step to beat his player on the inside (which even if successful is covered by the defence drifting across). Feeding his winger was always going to be a work on for Rog, but with no shapes, decoys, movement off the ball, theres no overlaps or space created, most from what ive seen when he's been criticised for not passing to his winger, their covered anyway, probably get bundled out into touch.

We know that he's special in that he can beat players 1 on 1 either with footwork or busting the line, but for christ sake, he'd be even more dangerous with a little bit more space that some shape would throw up. Surely that's on the left edge halfback to organize that. Against the Dragons there was none whatsoever, the few times they did get it, it was just straight hands.......worryingly enough the only time their seems to be a hint of shape is when SJ sweeps round which seems to start everyone moving.

Connection and timing on that left was always going to be a work in progress, especially when Metcalf was running that edge..... but damn it seems to be totally non existant of late....and that's not just on Rog.

People that are throwing daggers at Roger aren't understanding that our sets are crafted to areas on the field for right edge plays.

The only play we really see is SJ jumping across for a line ball to Ford.

We simply don't shape sets to get to areas where the left edge can be given any nice shape.

We kick only right unless something goes wrong with the set and we are forced to kick left. We attack shape only right, and revert left as an afterthought if something doesn't come off on the right and we end up with a play the ball past the right post.

It's a big reason why all the Montoya talk is frustrating. If we are only using one edge for trucking the ball up, then how is the edge supposed to be in flow when they do get a chance.

 

[Inruin]

People that are throwing daggers at Roger aren't understanding that our sets are crafted to areas on the field for right edge plays.

The only play we really see is SJ jumping across for a line ball to Ford.

We simply don't shape sets to get to areas where the left edge can be given any nice shape.

We kick only right unless something goes wrong with the set and we are forced to kick left. We attack shape only right, and revert left as an afterthought if something doesn't come off on the right and we end up with a play the ball past the right post.

It's a big reason why all the Montoya talk is frustrating. If we are only using one edge for trucking the ball up, then how is the edge supposed to be in flow when they do get a chance.

A number of times we have had good shape on the left and it's not used. Jackson Ford's try against South's was a great example. He wasn't the best option for SJ to play. We had RTS and Montoya on a two man overlap if he had gone out the back to TMM instead.

 

[Boats n Hoes]

It's a big reason why all the Montoya talk is frustrating. If we are only using one edge for trucking the ball up, then how is the edge supposed to be in flow when they do get a chance.

Agreed. "Pompey for RTS", "Pompey for Montoya", "need a speedster on that wing"......wont make an iota of difference 1, if their not going that way and 2 if there;s no shape or space created when they do.

Ive no problems with us being a right side dominated attack, we should be, clearly thats the edge thats more effective, has their timing and shape sorted and is one of the most lethal edge attacks in the comp. However i just think if we can have a viable left edge as well and go their from time to time it'll help that right side be even more lethal by defences not being able to stack their left edge and open up a bit more space.

Should however preface this by saying i still think defence lost us that game against the Dragons, they we're able to roll up the field with ease and we we're dropping off tackles in the red zone....the energy level/vibe from successive hard fought games looked like it finally caught up with the boys from after the first 20 and we were flat there after......and tbh i thought that was compounded by not using the full quota of bench players.....just looked like it ground Tohu/Capewell and co further down.

 

[CWC]

It was good to see Roger running back inside to explore space, part of learning/trying at this stage, like others said there was just nothing on for him on the left edge, even TMM was cutting back in most of the time.

I remember the Storm game would be a good platform but they haven't explored it further, he made a big break when they got him with a 1 on 1, and we got the bombs back twice kicking towards him resulting in a try, and Monty got a great try from a CHT kick in another game, so I have no idea why they persist on vertical bombing to the right and making defensive tackles, when SJ is within 30m and had no angle to work with, a bomb across to the left for RTS and Monty is a no brainer

Maybe SJ is too sore to train, but they should have others like TMM practicing coming to the middle and bombing to the left. It's just sad to see SJ doing all the attacks even when he's injured or opposition worked you out, you've got other playmakers who used to guide teams, work with them!

 

[Inruin]

It was good to see Roger running back inside to explore space, part of learning/trying at this stage, like others said there was just nothing on for him on the left edge, even TMM was cutting back in most of the time.

I remember the Storm game would be a good platform but they haven't explored it further, he made a big break when they got him with a 1 on 1, and we got the bombs back twice kicking towards him resulting in a try, and Monty got a great try from a CHT kick in another game, so I have no idea why they persist on vertical bombing to the right and making defensive tackles, when SJ is within 30m and had no angle to work with, a bomb across to the left for RTS and Monty is a no brainer

Maybe SJ is too sore to train, but they should have others like TMM practicing coming to the middle and bombing to the left. It's just sad to see SJ doing all the attacks even when he's injured or opposition worked you out, you've got other playmakers who used to guide teams, work with them!

Does TMM need to be more vocal or demanding of the ball? Does SJ need to step back a little and allow others the space and chance to play like DCE does? Does Egan need to be more selective with his options? Does the team need to set up better for left side attacks? Do we need more dynamic second rowers to hold the defence with their running threat? Are we just struggling with the number of forwards we have injured and unavailable? All of the above?

 

[John Nick]

Does TMM need to be more vocal or demanding of the ball? Dies SJ need to step back a little and allow others the space and chance to play like DCE does? Does Egan need to be more selective with his options? Does the team need to set up better for left side attacks? Do we need more dynamic second rowers to hold the defence with their running threat? Are we just struggling with the number of forwards we have injured and unavailable? All of the above?

I think tmm has a lot of talent but certainly should be up in the line
demanding the ball.
Seems to be hanging back too often.
Oppositions loadings the right edge defense knowing that is our only attacking edge

 

[CWC]

Does TMM need to be more vocal or demanding of the ball? Does SJ need to step back a little and allow others the space and chance to play like DCE does? Does Egan need to be more selective with his options? Does the team need to set up better for left side attacks? Do we need more dynamic second rowers to hold the defence with their running threat? Are we just struggling with the number of forwards we have injured and unavailable? All of the above?

Probably all of the above I'm just not sure if SJ is not training, what are the playmakers doing at trainings, wouldn't they want to reverse the shape and practice the left side? Or are the forwards so gassed they can't run lines?

I thought Ford was fine with the attack in the weekend after dropping a pass (that's his fault) the week before, even had a half break, again just not given enough chances to run with, the left edge is like a batsman who can't play bouncers, and refusing to practice playing against.....bouncers, when he has the skills to hook it for 6 all day

 

[Inruin]

Probably all of the above I'm just not sure if SJ is not training, what are the playmakers doing at trainings, wouldn't they want to reverse the shape and practice the left side? Or are the forwards so gassed they can't run lines?

I thought Ford was fine with the attack in the weekend after dropping a pass (that's his fault) the week before, even had a half break, again just not given enough chances to run with, the left edge is like a batsman who can't play bouncers, and refusing to practice playing against.....bouncers, when he has the skills to hook it for 6 all day

Ford clearly got injured on the weekend early on. 3 runs for 32m

The stats show a little more involvement by TMM than Metcalf despite clearly still favoring the right hand edge in every game and 3 line breaks show he is up and taking the line on or in support.

I think Dylan Walker will help fix that link a little better (I'm hoping) We have seen good things from that left edge previously. You only have to look at the Knights semi final last year to see a better balanced attack from us. For what ever reason we haven't been able to replicate it this season so far. There have been some glimpses but nothing consistent.