General Pro Attack.... Rookie Defense....

jonno

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 13, 2014
9,804
On attack.............. Outstanding....



On defense....... No comment.....

He's our most promising rookie by a long way,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, on attack.

On defense he's a work in progress and I hope he gets himself up to NRL standard quick smart.

I'd hate to see him ending up like Tupo and Carlos.....
 

phil.kingston

1st Grade Fringe
Jun 15, 2013
744
can't remember which interview it was, but he once mentioned that Manu and JRo have been helping him with his defence....he needs to spend sometime with mannering

Btw, he's not our only winger who doesn't wrap his arms against those he's tackling...and looks to push them into touch rather than tackle them into touch
 

jonno

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 13, 2014
9,804
can't remember which interview it was, but he once mentioned that Manu and JRo have been helping him with his defence....he needs to spend sometime with mannering

Btw, he's not our only winger who doesn't wrap his arms against those he's tackling...and looks to push them into touch rather than tackle them into touch
:banghead:
 
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gREVUS

Long live the Rainbows and Butterflies
Contributor
May 8, 2012
7,967
can't remember which interview it was, but he once mentioned that Manu and JRo have been helping him with his defence....he needs to spend sometime with mannering

Btw, he's not our only winger who doesn't wrap his arms against those he's tackling...and looks to push them into touch rather than tackle them into touch
True that, the small difference being looking at those pics he was there way sooner than Manu and instead of extending his body out to reach the player should have easily been able to wrap him up.
 
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Defence

Warriors 1st Grader
May 9, 2012
5,678
That was an embarrassing effort- started calling him pussytua after that one.
Seriously tho, he's got the goods- just needs to fire up a bit.
 

Sup42

Warriors 1st Grader
May 7, 2012
16,867
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
 
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jonno

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 13, 2014
9,804
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
If he has the heart of a champion he'll take this opportunity to become a champion defender.

Sure do hope so...
 

wallacenz

Warriors 1st Grader
May 7, 2012
7,328
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
I find this attitude pretty hard to take. Hiku is able to slot in at Manly having come through the same system. Fusitua had been playing well. Relating it to you're jigsaw analogy, its like taking a piece and putting it aside to set in the puzzle last, even though it might help you complete the puzzle.

It seems the Warriors are always looking to the future and never getting there.
 

brightman

1st Grade Fringe
May 18, 2012
3,510
Auckland
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
You're so full of it

Those tacklebots, well, Manners has scored 8 tries this season and Henry has bagged a few also.
As for your comments on Manu and Hurrell, both are playing well on defense this season, in fact Manu has played the best defense in his career with Laumape at center and Hurrell is vastly improved.

Fusitua is only 19? He will improve
 

Sup42

Warriors 1st Grader
May 7, 2012
16,867
You're so full of it

Those tacklebots, well, Manners has scored 8 tries this season and Henry has bagged a few also.
As for your comments on Manu and Hurrell, both are playing well on defense this season, in fact Manu has played the best defense in his career with Laumape at center and Hurrell is vastly improved.

Fusitua is only 19? He will improve
I take it you strongly disagree,

Bolded = coaching making the difference......or do you live in a world where Manu and Hurrell are naturalised good defenders ?

As for Mannerings eight Try's....again they stand out as a major shift with the new set moves placing him over the Try line.

Do you live in a world where Mannering is a ball playing forward of some repute when the play shifts outside of the structure ?

Fusitua is 19 and will get better....i don't get that comment.....I was just making an observation that historically these players are poorly rounded off in their skills base prior to coming into first grade.
 

rugged

1st Grade Fringe
May 1, 2012
1,856
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.
While we have recruited some one dimensional players, I wouldn't say that is the basis for our recruitment. The likes of Mateo, Tomkins, Inu and to a lesser extent Tommy and the hoffinator are not what I would describe as one dimensional. When you add in that we have made serious plays for Carney and Matai it is clear we are not only trying to recruit one dimensional players.


Do you live in a world where Mannering is a ball playing forward of some repute when the play shifts outside of the structure ?
Mannering may not be a ball playing forward, but he is a threat on the edge since he got his leg drive back. You are correct that he is benefitting from good structure but you still have to have the ability to take advantage of that structure.
 
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¿N. ig-mah¿

Warriors 1st Grader
May 1, 2012
6,081
Invercargill
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
With recent information coming to light, I'm not sure we can say Fusitua is serving time in the NSWarriors. He hasn't taken the field since his non-selection for first grade and is now being described as still recovering from a groin injury. He may not have been dropped at all, simply not selected for 1sts because he wasn't a guaranteed starter.

And, I noted your desperate attempt to start a new debate, even if others didn't. Discretely placing Benry (and the new and improved Mannering) in your tacklebot bracket. It may have worked had you not already tried to stir anti-Hurrel shit in another thread already.
 

¿N. ig-mah¿

Warriors 1st Grader
May 1, 2012
6,081
Invercargill
I take it you strongly disagree,

Bolded = coaching making the difference......or do you live in a world where Manu and Hurrell are naturalised good defenders ?

As for Mannerings eight Try's....again they stand out as a major shift with the new set moves placing him over the Try line.

Do you live in a world where Mannering is a ball playing forward of some repute when the play shifts outside of the structure ?

Fusitua is 19 and will get better....i don't get that comment.....I was just making an observation that historically these players are poorly rounded off in their skills base prior to coming into first grade.
This might not be the view of many, but I am not convinced the changes we have seen are entirely Cappy-related. There are many reasons, and I still believe that Elliot played a part in some of our improvements. Perhaps Cappy is bringing them all together at once, and building a plan around them.

Manu's improved defence can be quite obviously directed towards Ngani. Perhaps through McFadden's direction, but clearly the direction is not working with other centres (not mentioning any names - Nielson) Manu is playing his instictive game (and quite frequently rushing, when partnered with Laumape). Laumape is simply playing with the knowledge that Manu will rush, so he has to take the winger. Worked virtually every time.

Konrad's defensive improvement began pre-season last year. At the 2013 Dunedin trial, Konny and Fish had a defensive/offensive gameplan where they switched and changed frequently. Both of them played very solid defensive games, and Konrad's defence began to improve from there. His rush has decreased, and when he goes, he never doubts himself. Gone are the days of Konrad charging up 2 steps, pausing and then looking pissed off at himself for doing it again.

Mannering's attack has come about from Tomkins presence. Last year, we saw it a couple of times where Locke was the out the back player, and Mannering was the front runner. It created doubt. Now with Tomkins (a far superior attacking threat to Locke) behind the play, or even the risk of Tomkis being there is creating a bit of hesitation in the defence which is giving Mannering the space to get through. That play wasn't utilised enough last year, and Locke wasn't good enough to scare the defence, but it would have worked more often than not (depending on the ball passer making the right decision).

The rubbish talk about Fusitua needing to sort himself is over the top. He is a rookie. He is learning the intencity it takes to play first grade. He is also learning his teammates techniques. He made one shocking defensive play, and is a little quiet in defence. This will all come in time. But almost every rookie winger makes shocking decisions. You only learn from experience. Most (actually, I would have to say ALL) wingers are brought into first grade specifically for their attack. The defence is worked on afterwards. A winger is first and foremost a finisher, and every winger gets caught out.
 
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brightman

1st Grade Fringe
May 18, 2012
3,510
Auckland
I take it you strongly disagree,

Bolded = coaching making the difference......or do you live in a world where Manu and Hurrell are naturalised good defenders ?

As for Mannerings eight Try's....again they stand out as a major shift with the new set moves placing him over the Try line.

Do you live in a world where Mannering is a ball playing forward of some repute when the play shifts outside of the structure ?

Fusitua is 19 and will get better....i don't get that comment.....I was just making an observation that historically these players are poorly rounded off in their skills base prior to coming into first grade.
Well I strongly disagree with your comments. Mannerings always been capable, but not all 2nd rowers should be SBW like and alot of their play revolves around the coaching structure. As for Manu, well Ngani, when played at center, worked his arse off in D giving Manu the confidence he needed to play positional and not reacting to poor structure on his inside. Hurrell debuted when he was 19? Now 2 yrs later his D is much improved, same will apply to Fusitua.

Stop thinking every player should be perfect and well rounded before making the FG team, do you get that comment? Some players are too good to leave out (Hurrell and Manu) and will learn more with experience in FG
 

jonno

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 13, 2014
9,804
This might not be the view of many, but I am not convinced the changes we have seen are entirely Cappy-related. There are many reasons, and I still believe that Elliot played a part in some of our improvements. Perhaps Cappy is bringing them all together at once, and building a plan around them.

Manu's improved defence can be quite obviously directed towards Ngani. Perhaps through McFadden's direction, but clearly the direction is not working with other centres (not mentioning any names - Nielson) Manu is playing his instictive game (and quite frequently rushing, when partnered with Laumape). Laumape is simply playing with the knowledge that Manu will rush, so he has to take the winger. Worked virtually every time.
What I want to know is which structure is Cappy asking Manu/Nielsen to follow. Because in the Manly game Nielsen followed Lion around the park like a magnet and was never in position to double round behind Manu. He stood inside Lion and pushed him towards the sideline.

Is this what the team are practicing all week?

Or is Cappy asking Manu to come off his wing and let Nielsen cover in behind him?

Just thinking about those two following different and completely incompatible defensive structures is doing my head in.... One of them must be going against the coaching plan surely?
 

facefacts

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 26, 2012
2,787
Folks the warriors recruitment and development is built around one dimensional players.

Bowling big bullies V small body types...these big boys can't read the play for shit.
They get around this by stocking with one dimensional defenders to make up the mix ( tacklebots Mannering /Bahna/Taylor/Benry/friend etc).

Stupid mentality. A sports team is not meant to be a jigsaw. Rounded players play in the top four teams.

Mix and match teams make up the lower eight.

Fusitua is well served to spend time in the Vulcans to round his skills off.....if he is developed into a good tackler '/ reader of the attack he will leave Hurrell /Manu behind when he comes back online.
Hurrell and Manu are archetypal one dimension players.....Hurrell is > than Manu.......Hurrell spent time back in the Vulcans which has lifted his off the ball awareness out of sight ( V the Eels Hurrell tells Johnson to run it then backs up the play) Manu on the other hand is Akland Styled old school.....he wuld never instruct a half back.
Yeah we've certainly had our fill of one trick ponies at the club.

Fusitua is a hard one to get a read on, he's never looked like an great talent to me but comes up with very high quality plays that usually only come from high class players. He like most young players needs to get his head around the mental side of the game, for example i think he was injured in the Broncs game and used that injury as an excuse to put in some very weak efforts throughout the game, something that would have been excused in junior footy but is unacceptable in the NRL.

I think Hurrell is turning into a fine defender, the fact that he's been able to improve in such a short space of time going from a kid with no idea what the hell he was doing to a solid defender in a season is impressive in my opinion.

Manu is a lost cause, if he hasn't got wing defense after ten seasons he's not gonna get it now, people will just have to keep blaming whoever the latest unlucky center is who's posted next to dumb dumb.

Neilson is a gumby in nearly all aspects of the game, but is a good defender in a regimented well drilled defensive line like he had at Melbourne...as for his offense, he's got nothing, the Storm are famous for their back line set plays of which he was never a part. Now theres a one dimensional player.
 

Gizzyfan

Warriors 1st Grader
Jan 2, 2013
4,121
The difference for Kiwi boys is that the depth of competition coming through the grades isn't there like in especially NSW. Fusitua would probably be about a year ahead in his development if he had played in those comps coming through.

I have no doubts he will become a good first grade player on a consistent basis. It seems he has an injury so playing NRL with an injury will easily affect the confidence/form of a young guy. Right move to drop him back.

The benefits of the linking of the NSW and First Grade sides will become apparent in the next year or so when we will have a shit load of young, big skilled, fast guys READY for Grade.
 

facefacts

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 26, 2012
2,787
What I want to know is which structure is Cappy asking Manu/Nielsen to follow. Because in the Manly game Nielsen followed Lion around the park like a magnet and was never in position to double round behind Manu. He stood inside Lion and pushed him towards the sideline.

Is this what the team are practicing all week?

Or is Cappy asking Manu to come off his wing and let Nielsen cover in behind him?

Just thinking about those two following different and completely incompatible defensive structures is doing my head in.... One of them must be going against the coaching plan surely?

Lets think about it for a second...Neilson who played at the ridiculously well drilled Storm under Bellamy, and then we have Vatuvei who is the king of dumb ass mistakes and horrible decision making....now who do you think is following the game plan and who is just winging it?
 

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