Post Match NRL 2021 - Round 9 - Manly vs Warriors Post Match Discussion

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Vs

01 Jan 1970 12:00
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bangbros18

1st Grade Fringe
May 20, 2019
2,138
Been avoiding posting because that game made me pretty mad but in hindsight we have had one of the worst injury lists in the comp and a lot of young players that are still learning so performances like that will happen. Chalk this one up as a loss and move on, I am still confident we will be there or there abouts come the business end of the season and make the 8.

Also, Turbo was in an absolute mood yesterday and would have torn pretty much every team apart besides the panthers.
I think this injured list is a bit of a smoke screen though, I feel we have played some better football with those guys not there? Yes Addin Fonua-Blake would make a huge difference, but to say hiku, Aitkin, Fusitua and Chanel Harris-Tavita are huge outs I'm not so sure. I think Ben Murdoch-Masila was a big out but would that have won us the game?
 

snake77

Warriors 1st Grader
Jul 12, 2013
9,356
Auckland
Always a fan of riding a hot hand- hate changing a winning team.
Seems to be a bit of a habit at this club- whenever we’re going well they get a bit ahead of themselves and change things up.
Anyway hats off to tommy turbo- best player in the game IMO and was just too hot for our inexperienced defense.
We always seem to bring back the guys with a name even though the unheralded guys are performing.

The club has taken its eye off the ball a lot over the years.

  • When Watson first took over they were going alright and then started looking at a Super Rugby side or a side based here playing in Europe. Can't recall the exact details.
  • Over the years they have decided to be a NZ team like its an international competition. My stance has always been lest win a premiership first even if it is with 17 Aussies, we can get cute on the make up of the team with the 2nd or 3rd premiership.
  • The decision to move on Cleary could be looked at the same way. The club had a period of stability and were making the finals. Its a matter of hindsight as the right coach or changes could of improved things. Keep this brief as its been debated to death already.

Last year with teams that didn't look appealing on paper we went alright.

Granted Walsh has only been here for a short time. But the coach constantly saying 'I don't know what I'm going to do' over the past few weeks is an atrocious look. He's basically admitting that he is making it up as he goes along. That's a fucking great way to operate the team.

Brown is really doing nothing this year to change my opinion of him. I assumed he would be muddled coach that would be a slight upgrade on Kearney, but basically useless. So far we've not really seen any kind of structural improvements and honestly a few players have started going backwards. The improvements in the team have been purely from recruitment and I'd be interested to see how much of that is Brown vs POS/Club.
The uncertainty is ok now with Walsh coming in and Brown also being new to the club. Not sure how long of a honeymoon period we should have on both of those points.

They need to decide on a position for Walsh. If he's a half we still need to find Roger Tuivasa-Sheck's replacement at fullback.

On Brown himself if he comes off as uncertain it will soon rub off on the playing group. We have had enough player power over the years not keen to have it again. At some point he needs to understand his playing roster and make decisive decisions.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
3,805
Tauranga
I think this injured list is a bit of a smoke screen though, I feel we have played some better football with those guys not there? Yes Addin Fonua-Blake would make a huge difference, but to say hiku, Aitkin, Fusitua and Chanel Harris-Tavita are huge outs I'm not so sure. I think Ben Murdoch-Masila was a big out but would that have won us the game?
Death by a thousand cuts. No individual will be overly missed but they all add up. As well as those 6 there have been many lower tier players out injured as well.

Constant changes definitely impacts structure, combinations and communication, even if it’s a like for like player.
 

Warrior482

1st Grade Fringe
Oct 12, 2012
819
I like that Brown put his hand up for a smack over that loss. The rule changes are really putting a spotlight on bench selection and strategy more than ever, so hopefully everyone learns from that.
Seems an unpopular opinion here but we are performing BETTER than we should be with the pick n mix lineups we have been forced to use. The fact that players that inexperienced have performed as well as they have (Walsh included) to me points to competent coaching, at least in development of young talent (look at Newey now and the players Brown brought through).
The ruck is where it all breaks down, but that's how every team loses under the current rules. We need more smarts and polish when the ruck turns to custard. So often we have bodies on the deck at the ptb, and don't recover. Which is why we are pretty much flat track bullies right now.
Watching the Roosters the past weekend I was impressed with their commitment and technique in holding that ruck together (mostly), even knowing when to give away 6 agains... they are smart. And I hate the Roosters lol.
 

john nick

1st Grade Fringe
Mar 28, 2020
2,593
tauranga
I like that Brown put his hand up for a smack over that loss. The rule changes are really putting a spotlight on bench selection and strategy more than ever, so hopefully everyone learns from that.
Seems an unpopular opinion here but we are performing BETTER than we should be with the pick n mix lineups we have been forced to use. The fact that players that inexperienced have performed as well as they have (Walsh included) to me points to competent coaching, at least in development of young talent (look at Newey now and the players Brown brought through).
The ruck is where it all breaks down, but that's how every team loses under the current rules. We need more smarts and polish when the ruck turns to custard. So often we have bodies on the deck at the ptb, and don't recover. Which is why we are pretty much flat track bullies right now.
Watching the Roosters the past weekend I was impressed with their commitment and technique in holding that ruck together (mostly), even knowing when to give away 6 agains... they are smart. And I hate the Roosters lol.
Great post and opinion mate
 

Tragic

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 27, 2016
4,476
Kumeu
I would take K.Iro at his worst over Ken anyday.Iro was a superstar and Ken has a long way to go to even be in the same ballpark.Like comparing a ferrari to a humber 80!
I remember him being inconsistent asf, was the Beast one minute busting it up then go missing for half hour then do something freaky again. Went to Super League and ripped it up, kinda like Konnie. Ken is different, has size but doesn't have the explosive power but he works hard which is something Kev wasn't known for.

Neither is a Ferrari or a Humber. Ken is a Mk IV Cortina, Kev a Mk IV Zephyr with a few years on it that can go but not for long before it runs outta puff.

I like both cars but neither going to win the Cannonball Run.
 

Mr Frank White

Warriors 1st Grader
May 19, 2012
3,805
I'm actually not a fan of Kodi in the 14 role. For a number of reasons.

It upsets the makeup of our bench. I dont believe we can carry Jazz and Kodi on the bench. we need 3 forwards there - similarly we cant carry Jazz + Chanel Harris-Tavita or Walsh on the bench IMO

I actually think Kodi is better than Chanel Harris-Tavita by quite a margin

If Egan needs a rest then Jazz needs to do it, however I don't believe Egan is the problem - certainly not with our defence getting cut to bits out wide.

Walsh plays 80 minutes - if he is good enough he is old enough :)
This is where I'm at. For me Niko isnt good enough of a defender to spend at DH. Something Chanel Harris-Tavita is much better at
 

Mr Frank White

Warriors 1st Grader
May 19, 2012
3,805
I think this injured list is a bit of a smoke screen though, I feel we have played some better football with those guys not there? Yes Addin Fonua-Blake would make a huge difference, but to say hiku, Aitkin, Fusitua and Chanel Harris-Tavita are huge outs I'm not so sure. I think Ben Murdoch-Masila was a big out but would that have won us the game?

Ben Murdoch-Masila & Aitken are big losses. All Aitken has to do is be as good as Berry and our defence is instantly better.
Hiku is good old rocks and diamonds. Could have helped us score points earlier in the season
 

bruce

Warriors 1st Grader
Contributor
Sep 1, 2015
17,486
.Iro was a superstar
Have you got stats to support that?

I saw Iro score some amazing tries for Manly, and the Kiwis, but in reality his record in the NRL is ordinary.

I remember one game at Brookvale where he fielded the ball deep in his in goal and ran down the field fending, swerving and just belting players out of the way. It was an amazing try, it was no fluke. The guy had the talent, but superstar? No way.

Iro scored 12 tries in the NRL over about 3 seasons. Ken has scored 41 tries in 6 seasons.

Where Iro was a superstar was for Wigan, in a top team against weak opposition. It might be unfair but I think he could be called a flat track bully. He also scored a brilliant try for the Kiwis in that Eden Park disaster in 1988.That try was no flue either.

However a winger scoring about 7 tries a season is pretty ordinary for Ken too.

What Iro had was genuine speed, and so did Manu.
 

leaguepunk66

Waterboy
May 2, 2016
7
Have you got stats to support that?

I saw Iro score some amazing tries for Manly, and the Kiwis, but in reality his record in the NRL is ordinary.

I remember one game at Brookvale where he fielded the ball deep in his in goal and ran down the field fending, swerving and just belting players out of the way. It was an amazing try, it was no fluke. The guy had the talent, but superstar? No way.

Iro scored 12 tries in the NRL over about 3 seasons. Ken has scored 41 tries in 6 seasons.

Where Iro was a superstar was for Wigan, in a top team against weak opposition. It might be unfair but I think he could be called a flat track bully. He also scored a brilliant try for the Kiwis in that Eden Park disaster in 1988.That try was no flue either.

However a winger scoring about 7 tries a season is pretty ordinary for Ken too.

What Iro had was genuine speed, and so did Manu.
Hey Bruce,you are right,i dont have the stats to back up my impression of Iro as a superstar.tend to have a bit of a selective memory with players from the past i.e only rememberin the good bits,which to be fair in Iros case,there were a few!-stats arent everything and i still think Iro was a class above Ken,just my opinion.In Kens case he is not a natural winger,seems to lack a sidestep,or a swerve or a fend and has been pretty horrible defensively.could be his sternum injury?
 
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bruce

Warriors 1st Grader
Contributor
Sep 1, 2015
17,486
Can get metres elsewhere. Don't keep a slow limited winger because of a handful of metres. It simply costs too much elsewhere on both sides of the ball.
Totally agree, and I bet the current management think so as well.
 

JaggedJ

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 19, 2018
2,972
Totally agree, and I bet the current management think so as well.

Yup which is why I'm watching this year without much invested or too much criticism for Brownie.

I think next year we'll get a better idea of what the make up of his side will be and I don't think it includes slow limited wingers.

Might be harsh on Ken, but that final minute dash for the corner should have been a light bulb moment if it hadn't already gone off.
 
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