Gizzyfan

Warriors 1st Grader
Jan 2, 2013
4,443
I cannot stand Trump, but since when has it become the medias role to invoke censorship. They are unelected private companies. Bruce will not like this, but they do have political bias.

What they should be doing is airing the speech then make their case to the people about it.

Michael Moore has done some good stuff but seems to be past his use by date as a film maker. He is still a canny pundit and knows how the disaffectd think.

They might need more than the National Guard. I suppose they have invaded most of the world why not themselves saves fuel costs.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
2,770
Tauranga
Major networks aren't even showing Trumps speech today in person, just plainly not airing his rants any more.

Totally cut off by the parasitic media that feed off his rubbish. So far I see ABC and MSNBC are not showing his speech.
The media finally realise the role they play in all this by giving him air.

Personally think they should show his speech as he’s the president - it’s the days of comment and ridiculing afterwards from the media that they need to cut out to stop stirring everything up.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
2,770
Tauranga
It will be interesting to see where his brand of content goes in the coming years, listening to a podcast today that from time to time will analyse some conspiracy type stuff and they among others are starting to stop broadcasting in the fear that they will be lumped in with extremists and deplatformed.
Chilling isn’t it. This is why we fight so hard to protect free speech. Paves the way for 1984.

We may not like what people say but I’ll fight for their right to say it - including Trump.
 

Noitall

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 21, 2019
1,329
Corporates and the Miltary Industrial Complex.
Taken a bit of time to process what you say but does the military want civil war where americans fight each other rather than an enemy. The only way “corporates” would want a breakdown in america as far as I can see is a heliburton scenario to rebuild the country like in Iraq. This is definitely heading for civil war where pro democracy people are ready to fight pro trump people in a land where guns are the norm. The only power I see all this benefiting is another country as a weaker or occupied america is good for their plight.
 

JP_576

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 4, 2020
158
I've heard the military has come out and said Biden will be the next president and condemned the actions of the rioters. Other than a very very small minority that could have bad intentions I trust the majority of the US military will be loyal to their oath.


The US has been embarrassed once, I can't see them letting it happen again.

Also absolutely disgusting how some of the Republicans voting against impeachment have the audacity to go on about it's about unity and democrats voting for impeachment are going to cause more division and violence in the country.
First of all it was your colleagues that encouraged the violence by going along with the bs narrative of voter fraud.

Secondly it's your president that is refusing to attend the inauguration. If you truly believed in unity you would get all your colleagues to condemn the actions of the president and the few senators peddling the voter fraud bs, confirm there was no voter fraud and that Joe Biden won a fair election and commit to supporting Joe Biden in a non partisan way if there's ever another attack on democracy in the future.

Thirdly when was it acceptable for the United states to bow down to threats of violence or terror
 

JP_576

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 4, 2020
158
Chilling isn’t it. This is why we fight so hard to protect free speech. Paves the way for 1984.

We may not like what people say but I’ll fight for their right to say it - including Trump.
As much as i may hate Trump but i agree with this. Air his speech but put a disclaimer underneath if you have to or point out his lies.
This could go bad in the future if there's genuine voices being silenced by media.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
2,770
Tauranga
I've heard the military has come out and said Biden will be the next president and condemned the actions of the rioters. Other than a very very small minority that could have bad intentions I trust the majority of the US military will be loyal to their oath.


The US has been embarrassed once, I can't see them letting it happen again.

Also absolutely disgusting how some of the Republicans voting against impeachment have the audacity to go on about it's about unity and democrats voting for impeachment are going to cause more division and violence in the country.
First of all it was your colleagues that encouraged the violence by going along with the bs narrative of voter fraud.

Secondly it's your president that is refusing to attend the inauguration. If you truly believed in unity you would get all your colleagues to condemn the actions of the president and the few senators peddling the voter fraud bs, confirm there was no voter fraud and that Joe Biden won a fair election and commit to supporting Joe Biden in a non partisan way if there's ever another attack on democracy in the future.

Thirdly when was it acceptable for the United states to bow down to threats of violence or terror
It should be noted the extremist are a small minority. There is not going to be a civil war unless the leadership is stupid. The way it escalates is if you keep pushing the people that are hurting. You don’t fix BLM by marginalising blacks. You don’t fix Trump by ostracising Trump supporters.

What heals division is cool heads and time. Impeachment and making examples of people creates martyrs. Ignore these guys. Impeaching Trump last time only made him stronger. Focus on the big picture rather and moving forward. Focus on the future and building a united America rather than continually focusing on the division. (Take note media).
 

Gizzyfan

Warriors 1st Grader
Jan 2, 2013
4,443
Taken a bit of time to process what you say but does the military want civil war where americans fight each other rather than an enemy. The only way “corporates” would want a breakdown in america as far as I can see is a heliburton scenario to rebuild the country like in Iraq. This is definitely heading for civil war where pro democracy people are ready to fight pro trump people in a land where guns are the norm. The only power I see all this benefiting is another country as a weaker or occupied america is good for their plight.

By Military Industrial Complex is meant the Lobbyists, Corporations and manufacturers that directly feed off the Defence budget. Eisenhauer warned about them in his farewell address from the Whitehouse.

Halliburton, Blackwater and others are dangerous as they do not have the Military fire orders. You can also add in some Security firms who have been used to attack pipeline protesters.

The US has the highest percentage incarceration rate in the World, Prisoners are used to make multiple stuff from ballistic armour to office furniture. So the Prison Industrial Complex is another to include.
 
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JP_576

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 4, 2020
158
It should be noted the extremist are a small minority. There is not going to be a civil war unless the leadership is stupid. The way it escalates is if you keep pushing the people that are hurting. You don’t fix BLM by marginalising blacks. You don’t fix Trump by ostracising Trump supporters.
I would just like to point out that blm was a stand against police brutality and asking for equality with genuine anger behind it due to centuries of injustice.

These Trump supporters at the Capitol were trying to stage a coup by storming a federal building with politicians inside because they weren't happy with an election result.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
2,770
Tauranga
I would just like to point out that blm was a stand against police brutality and asking for equality with genuine anger behind it due to centuries of injustice.

These Trump supporters at the Capitol were trying to stage a coup by storming a federal building with politicians inside because they weren't happy with an election result.
America is divided. The middle class has been ignored for years. Huge inequality. Lowering wealth due to globalisation. No social support. Etc.

There is similar issue to the BLM with real long term anger at the leadership. That is why, despite everything - 70m people supported an idiot, because he gave them hope and tapped into the big issues.

It’s much more than just storming the capital. People talk of civil war for a reason
 

gREVUS

Long live the Rainbows and Butterflies
Contributor
May 8, 2012
8,261
interesting that sedition is defined as an attempt to overthrow (yea hard to prove) or oppose the government by use of force (OH WOW).

the ones in brackets are my thoughts. I thought the sedition charge would be largely toothless, but that second part just being in the building would be enough to get a conviction IMO. Carrying weapons, erecting a gallows, any use of force against protectors of the senate - so possibly even pushing cops in a riot line to access congress, would be enough to get you on their lists
 

gREVUS

Long live the Rainbows and Butterflies
Contributor
May 8, 2012
8,261
Taken a bit of time to process what you say but does the military want civil war where americans fight each other rather than an enemy. The only way “corporates” would want a breakdown in america as far as I can see is a heliburton scenario to rebuild the country like in Iraq. This is definitely heading for civil war where pro democracy people are ready to fight pro trump people in a land where guns are the norm. The only power I see all this benefiting is another country as a weaker or occupied america is good for their plight.
So Canada then.

Would be fair after alll these years if the US ended up back in the commonwealth
 

gREVUS

Long live the Rainbows and Butterflies
Contributor
May 8, 2012
8,261
It should be noted the extremist are a small minority. There is not going to be a civil war unless the leadership is stupid. The way it escalates is if you keep pushing the people that are hurting. You don’t fix BLM by marginalising blacks. You don’t fix Trump by ostracising Trump supporters.

What heals division is cool heads and time. Impeachment and making examples of people creates martyrs. Ignore these guys. Impeaching Trump last time only made him stronger. Focus on the big picture rather and moving forward. Focus on the future and building a united America rather than continually focusing on the division. (Take note media).
Its easy to sit back and say focus on harmony and getting on - but people have died dude.

Actions have consequences. If they dont do something about trump there will be a next time and it will probably be much worse.

He has ignored so much of their unwritten rules and tried to set himself up as a dictator, by ignoring even the most basic of the written rules; his threat has to be seen by the public to be wrong, a conviction will do this.

They may never want to change the DOD advice that no sitting president will ever be convicted, but to stop another trump happening in our lifetimes, they have to make a point and trump has to pay in some way for his actions.
 

Sup42

Warriors 1st Grader
May 7, 2012
17,707
interesting that sedition is defined as an attempt to overthrow (yea hard to prove) or oppose the government by use of force (OH WOW).

the ones in brackets are my thoughts. I thought the sedition charge would be largely toothless, but that second part just being in the building would be enough to get a conviction IMO. Carrying weapons, erecting a gallows, any use of force against protectors of the senate - so possibly even pushing cops in a riot line to access congress, would be enough to get you on their lists
Yeah they are screwed, and when you factor in they were trying to stop Pence conducting ceremonial constitutional acts...they have no defence.
In a few days Trumps a nobody. It’s Biden and congress’s country now. Look to the future.

It’s the last few days of a failure... don’t give the failure inertia.
How we got here in the first place is down playing and looking away from reality.

The threat is live, the movement already has inertia, I would bet a lot of money that worse is coming, no matter what happens with impeachment.

I firmly believe we have seen enough to accept that the Government of the US will be fighting to defend itself for the rest of Bidens four years.

In which case I do not think there is a choice to let Trump slide. The fight has to be fought, because the other side are not listening.

I do agree with the idea of not demonizing Trump supporters in general, however Trump is not among that harmless group who should be free to go about their lives.


I worry about global security if the US does not clean house, so called allies of the US are dependent on the US doing the right thing, otherwise they lose moral authority by association.

The 'alliances' are in tatters just now anyway. Time for a trial.

Nuremberg was about the rest of us, not the NAZIS or Germany.
 

wizards rage

1st Grade Fringe
Apr 18, 2016
2,770
Tauranga
Its easy to sit back and say focus on harmony and getting on - but people have died dude.
More people died in the BLM protests. Again - do we solve that by ostracising them? There are serious problems that are driving the anger behind this - ignoring that by punishment will result in more dead...

Actions have consequences. If they dont do something about trump there will be a next time and it will probably be much worse.
Careful what you wish for - the more you go after a person with popular support the stronger they become... The consequences of his leadership should be to ignore him and make him irrelevant. That’s what will hurt him and heal the country the most.
 

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