General 18th Man Debate

Do you want to see an 18th man added to the bench?

  • Yes

  • Yes but with tight restrictions

  • No


Results are only viewable after voting.

gpred

1st Grade Fringe
Contributor
Sep 23, 2016
1,008
Having an 18th man won't protect anyone from injuries, rather it will just expose an extra player to the possibility of a head injury?
 

Warrior#214

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 13, 2016
797
AK
The other couple of things Paul Kent said on 360 on this which I thought were interesting

1. That they were considering the 18th man should be a player from outside the wider squad i.e. a young developing player rather than a 100 game middle forward. Reducing the ability and attraction for coaches to stack the 18th man with an attractive playing option. It really would be a last resort.

2. He also rattled off all of the 50+ years of interchange history - from none at all, to injuries only, time bound interchanges etc and said that every single rule had in some way been exploited by a coach. It’s unreasonable to expect then that even with 3 HIAs and a less attractive 18th man option that at some stage some coach wouldn’t find a way to suit themselves and there game plan to exploit it. Medical staff are currently employed by the clubs and could be made neutral but that wouldn’t stop people from faking concussions if that suited them. The only thing which was mentioned which would be a serious disincentive to faking it would be a mandatory 10 Day stand down for any HIA.

it’s a good debate though and when it’s rooted in the current debate around player welfare it’s one worth having
 

Billyspleen75

1st Grade Fringe
May 8, 2012
701
Silverdale
Easy to rort.
Imagine Ryan James and Sebastian Kris knock each other out in the 10th minute of the game. 2 HIA's down.
Then Curtis Scott has a busted rib. He can continue on if the team is desperate but he's an easy target. The Raiders are effectively down to 14.5 players.
Tell Curtis Scott to fake a head knock. Answer some HIA questions wrong.
3 HIA's down.
18th man comes on.
Raiders are back up to 15 players.

(It's not awful that a team as decimated as the above would end up with an extra player, but just showing a scenario where a coach can use the rule to their advantage)
 
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john nick

1st Grade Fringe
Mar 28, 2020
3,464
tauranga
Having an 18th man won't protect anyone from injuries, rather it will just expose an extra player to the possibility of a head injury?

Easy to rort.
Imagine Ryan James and Sebastian Kris knock each other out in the 10th minute of the game. 2 HIA's down.
Then Curtis Scott has a busted rib. He can continue on if the team is desperate but he's an easy target. The Raiders are effectively down to 14.5 players.
Tell Curtis Scott to fake a head knock. Answer some HIA questions wrong.
3 HIA's down.
18th man comes on.
Raiders are back up to 15 players.

(It's not awful that a team as decimated as the above would end up with an extra player, but just showing a scenario where a coach can use the rule to their advantage)
Easy fix .Go off with HIA gotta standown for the following week
 

bangbros18

1st Grade Fringe
May 20, 2019
2,668
Not a fan of the 18th man at all, I think if your down you should have to suck it up. Yes it's a massive advantage to the other team but that's just unfortunate.
 
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Rick O'Shay

Warriors 1st Grader
May 1, 2013
4,917
New Plymouth
Not a fan of the 18th man at all, I think if your down you should have to suck it up. Yes it's a massive advantage to the other team but that's just unfortunate.
I'm with you. Its called The Luck of the Draw. There was no foul play involved in any of the Canberra HIAs and it wouldn't have mattered what the speed of the game was or how big the players were. It was an unfortunate clash of heads going into a tackle, could have happened to any side, dumb luck.

It certainly makes the game an interesting spectacle though but don't forget, we only won by 3 points and if we hadn't clawed our way back from oblivion, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Same for the forward pass technology.

If everyone and the NRL is so concerned about concussion, make helmets mandatory and have a compulsory 2 week stand. down.

Eliminate, Isolate, Minimise.
 
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Sky Waka

1st Grade Fringe
Aug 28, 2017
361
In past years when teams have been left without anyone on the bench, I've thought if a team lose a player in the 1st 10 minutes maybe they should get to add another player.

But now I think they should only add a player if they are left with 13 by half time, and since they are going to do it, it should not a development/up and coming player but one named on the extended squad on Tuesday.
 

fizurg

1st Grade Fringe
May 18, 2012
1,810
hamilton
I think we go back to the 4 man bench and only 4 interchanges.

Would change the game to suiting the players with endurance.

Would open the game up more towards the ends of each half.

Would potentially reduce injuries from players getting bigger and faster year on year and creating bigger and bigger impacts and collisions

I like the idea. The only issue I see is that is how union benches work. I can’t see the NRL liking making the games similar.
 

wizards rage

Warriors 1st Grader
Apr 18, 2016
5,137
Tauranga
They have addressed it perfectly. Come up with a solution that rarely need to be used but it looks like they care.

The last time 3 HIA happened before this weekend was reportedly in 2016...
 

wizards rage

Warriors 1st Grader
Apr 18, 2016
5,137
Tauranga
The whole idea is to encourage guys with head knock to come off .
Doctors make that decision and get in trouble if they cheat the system. It’s not up to the guys if they want to come off or not 😉
 

Miket12

Warriors 1st Grader
Apr 20, 2012
10,580

Rugby league: Warriors coach Nathan Brown slams new NRL concussion initiative, saying it will be virtually meaningless​

Warriors coach Nathan Brown has questioned the value of the NRL's new concussion replacement initiative, saying it will be irrelevant because the threshold is too high.

The Australian Rugby League Commission announced on Tuesday that clubs would be able to use an 18th man from round five onwards, if they lost three players to head knocks during a match.

The rule is designed to encourage teams to take a more cautious approach to assessing concussions, though the extra man is slated to be an emerging player, rather than just another first grader.

Brown supports the spirit of the rule but suggested it will be virtually meaningless in a practical context.

"I'm a fan of them bringing in an 18th man and I understand why they want a certain type of player [but] what I don't get is that you have to have three head knocks," said Brown.

"I'm not sure what the stats say but I've been coaching for a lot of years and I've never been involved in three head knocks [for one team] in one game ... so I don't get that part."

Brown said the 18th man should be activated if a team has two players fail head injury assessments (HIA's) during a match.

"Two would have been fair," said Brown. "[On Saturday] Canberra had two head knocks, then lost a bloke through injury, and had to leave a player out there with a floating rib.

"Against the Gold Coast [in round one] we played in 30-degree heat, had two blokes with head knocks that couldn't go back on, plus we had an injury. We had one reserve for a lot of that game and Euan Aitken had to play with a ruptured ankle ligament for [60 minutes].

"With two head knocks and one injury you are forcing other players to stay on the field injured because winning is very important part of playing professional sport. So I don't see the point of bringing the rule in."

Ahead of Sunday's clash with the Roosters, Brown is pleased with the progress so far this season. The thrilling 34-31 win over the Raiders was another step in the right direction, though the team will be far from complacent, after a shaky second quarter, which almost put the match out of sight.

"The first 15 minutes we were on top," said Brown. "When the two boys had the head clash for the Raiders the game stopped a bit and it was Canberra who went from third gear to fifth gear and we went from fourth gear to second gear. They scored three quick tries, thankfully halftime came for us because it didn't look like slowing anytime soon."

If that was a negative, the turnaround after halftime, which came from improved attitude and application, was noteworthy.

"To score five tries in a half of footy and doing it with controlled footy [was pleasing]," said Brown. "I hope they have worked out if you do certain things well consistently you are a handy team."

The Warriors were below their best in the first half against the Knights and the Raiders and still searching for that week-to-week consistency.

"It's early days at the moment," said Brown. "I can't make too many huge statements but certainly it's something we would like to achieve … not easy but something that we want."

The lockdown in Brisbane has had a knock on effect for the Warriors, with 13 players unable to travel to play for feeder club Redcliffe in the Queensland Cup.

"There are a large number of players that didn't get a game last week and won't for a few weeks," said Brown.

There are also four development players in quarantine in Brisbane at the moment, unable to train or play, after travelling up last week ahead of a match for the Redcliffe colts team.

 
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john nick

1st Grade Fringe
Mar 28, 2020
3,464
tauranga

Rugby league: Warriors coach Nathan Brown slams new NRL concussion initiative, saying it will be virtually meaningless​

Warriors coach Nathan Brown has questioned the value of the NRL's new concussion replacement initiative, saying it will be irrelevant because the threshold is too high.

The Australian Rugby League Commission announced on Tuesday that clubs would be able to use an 18th man from round five onwards, if they lost three players to head knocks during a match.

The rule is designed to encourage teams to take a more cautious approach to assessing concussions, though the extra man is slated to be an emerging player, rather than just another first grader.

Brown supports the spirit of the rule but suggested it will be virtually meaningless in a practical context.

"I'm a fan of them bringing in an 18th man and I understand why they want a certain type of player [but] what I don't get is that you have to have three head knocks," said Brown.

"I'm not sure what the stats say but I've been coaching for a lot of years and I've never been involved in three head knocks [for one team] in one game ... so I don't get that part."

Brown said the 18th man should be activated if a team has two players fail head injury assessments (HIA's) during a match.

"Two would have been fair," said Brown. "[On Saturday] Canberra had two head knocks, then lost a bloke through injury, and had to leave a player out there with a floating rib.

"Against the Gold Coast [in round one] we played in 30-degree heat, had two blokes with head knocks that couldn't go back on, plus we had an injury. We had one reserve for a lot of that game and Euan Aitken had to play with a ruptured ankle ligament for [60 minutes].

"With two head knocks and one injury you are forcing other players to stay on the field injured because winning is very important part of playing professional sport. So I don't see the point of bringing the rule in."

Ahead of Sunday's clash with the Roosters, Brown is pleased with the progress so far this season. The thrilling 34-31 win over the Raiders was another step in the right direction, though the team will be far from complacent, after a shaky second quarter, which almost put the match out of sight.

"The first 15 minutes we were on top," said Brown. "When the two boys had the head clash for the Raiders the game stopped a bit and it was Canberra who went from third gear to fifth gear and we went from fourth gear to second gear. They scored three quick tries, thankfully halftime came for us because it didn't look like slowing anytime soon."

If that was a negative, the turnaround after halftime, which came from improved attitude and application, was noteworthy.

"To score five tries in a half of footy and doing it with controlled footy [was pleasing]," said Brown. "I hope they have worked out if you do certain things well consistently you are a handy team."

The Warriors were below their best in the first half against the Knights and the Raiders and still searching for that week-to-week consistency.

"It's early days at the moment," said Brown. "I can't make too many huge statements but certainly it's something we would like to achieve … not easy but something that we want."

The lockdown in Brisbane has had a knock on effect for the Warriors, with 13 players unable to travel to play for feeder club Redcliffe in the Queensland Cup.

"There are a large number of players that didn't get a game last week and won't for a few weeks," said Brown.

There are also four development players in quarantine in Brisbane at the moment, unable to train or play, after travelling up last week ahead of a match for the Redcliffe colts team.

The headline says that he slams the new rules. The fact is he has said he would rather it be two rather than three. Very misleading headline. Nothing unusual though
 

Miket12

Warriors 1st Grader
Apr 20, 2012
10,580
The headline says that he slams the new rules. The fact is he has said he would rather it be two rather than three. Very misleading headline. Nothing unusual though
NZ Herald has a very unfortunate habit of providing far more sensationalised headlines than what is actually in their articles.
 
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